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Post by PG on Sept 15, 2020 8:15:49 GMT
Indeed it does - and now has......  It had one 3 hours ago.....  Yes, I've just noticed........ oh well.....  |
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Post by alf on Sept 20, 2020 8:28:46 GMT
Interesting to see the JLR straight 6 surface....
Racing, really drive an SUV or two before you get one, really drive it - it’s not enough that your mates Macan feels nippy around town. They have undeniable appeal - I’m always looking longingly at them - but having had the Q3 in the family and having slalomed the F pace against a bongo XF estate, normal cars just handle way way better. The weight transfer and feel is all wrong in SUVs when driving them hard. I noticed that when the Macan came out the mags all said it was capable but numb and not fun to corner hard - they changed their minds when the Porsche press people got to them, and when it sold so well, but that was their initial reaction....
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Post by michael on Sept 21, 2020 12:17:38 GMT
Interesting to see the JLR straight 6 surface.... Racing, really drive an SUV or two before you get one, really drive it - it’s not enough that your mates Macan feels nippy around town. They have undeniable appeal - I’m always looking longingly at them - but having had the Q3 in the family and having slalomed the F pace against a bongo XF estate, normal cars just handle way way better. The weight transfer and feel is all wrong in SUVs when driving them hard. I noticed that when the Macan came out the mags all said it was capable but numb and not fun to corner hard - they changed their minds when the Porsche press people got to them, and when it sold so well, but that was their initial reaction.... Most people don't drive like that. The day to day appeal and versatility of an SUV far outweighs the occasional hooning you might be able to get up to in a more focussed car. |
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Post by alf on Sept 21, 2020 13:31:34 GMT
Appeal yes, versatility not so much - there is less interior space in many SUV's than their car (and especially estate car) equivalents.
IF you need to rough-road it though, they do have appeal. I've stayed in places in Tuscany that were miles down proper gravel tracks, and I've mountain biked down some of their "roads", and cars could not handle it well...
I take your point about the driving - its the feel that gets me, not the on the limit performance. And - a big factor if you drive any more than one-up - the feel to passengers. In the Q3 (and the old V6 passat I had, which handled well in terms of balance but rolled like a bastard) you did not need to be doing much more than driving miss daisy to start getting moans from passengers. In kit that handles flatly and securely, especially if the ride is also OK, you can get away with far more and enjoy the drive far more before people complain...
I'm as bad as anyone on the appeal side. I absolutely love the new RSQ3 sportback, there is one in the local dealer in that bright RS blue and I adore it, but the reviews are crushingly awful and it costs a fortune so I'm not allowing myself to go near it...
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 21, 2020 14:12:01 GMT
Family acceptance is another issue. When looking at the BMW PHEVs the X45E was high on the list due to the tax implications (6-7-8% next three years). I could basically spec it how I liked. When W2.0 and I looked at them she said: these things are nice when we rent them on holiday but I couldn't have one parked on the driveway permanently.
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Post by Martin on Sept 21, 2020 14:26:16 GMT
It can be an issue, but not always. I have to push Lindsay for her preference as the standard (and genuine) response is that I should get what I want. Which is fine, but I follow that up with don't forget that you will spend a lot of time in it and will have to drive it regularly, but the response to that is that I wouldn't buy something that didn't drive well....
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 21, 2020 14:28:15 GMT
I got: no one ever drives it but you so get what you want. You'll only shout at us if we slam the doors or put dirty finger marks on the glass!
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Post by Martin on Sept 21, 2020 14:32:57 GMT
I got: no one ever drives it but you so get what you want. You'll only shout at us if we slam the doors or put dirty finger marks on the glass! Everyone knows not to do either of those in my car! Along with a few other things.... |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2020 15:34:10 GMT
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 21, 2020 18:10:29 GMT
Mrs RT generally likes the GC. She only doesn't like the noise it makes since I had it tuned. Or rather she likes the sound, but would much prefer it to be less noisy when it starts up or when you floor it. And it's bigger that she finds ideal - being short she find it difficult to work out where the corners are.
What she really likes are Maseratis. But at the same time, she firmly deems us not rich enough to justify spending that much on a car. And I did point out that there are no Maseratis which are smaller than a 4GC!
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Post by PG on Sept 21, 2020 19:14:34 GMT
Mrs RT generally likes the GC. She only doesn't like the noise it makes since I had it tuned. Or rather she likes the sound, but would much prefer it to be less noisy when it starts up or when you floor it. And it's bigger that she finds ideal - being short she find it difficult to work out where the corners are. What she really likes are Maseratis. But at the same time, she firmly deems us not rich enough to justify spending that much on a car. And I did point out that there are no Maseratis which are smaller than a 4GC!Not smaller but Macan sized and an SUV. Wait until 2021 and get a Maserati Grecale. Destined to play "a key role in the brand's development", the Porsche Macan rival will be built on the same production line as the Alfa Romeo Stelvio in the Fiat Chrysler Automobiles (FCA) plant in Cassino, Italy.
It will also share much of its underpinnings with the Stelvio, and a fully electric version is also due to arrive by 2022. However, the combustion engined models will use Maserati rather than Alfa-sourced engines.www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/maserati-names-new-small-suv-grecale-2021-launch#:~:text=Maserati%20has%20outlined%20further%20details,model%20that's%20due%20in%202021.&text=Of%20course%20it's%20still%20a,%2Dclass%20performance%20and%20handling%22. |
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Post by michael on Sept 21, 2020 19:37:30 GMT
I hope for Maserati’s sake it looks nothing like the Autocar rendering.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2020 21:02:17 GMT
Not into SUV's myself (Never, really?) but this should keep a healthy residual for at least the next few years. Might be a bargain ownership wise.
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Post by Tim on Sept 22, 2020 8:28:53 GMT
Family acceptance is another issue. When looking at the BMW PHEVs the X45E was high on the list due to the tax implications (6-7-8% next three years). I could basically spec it how I liked. When W2.0 and I looked at them she said: these things are nice when we rent them on holiday but I couldn't have one parked on the driveway permanently. I drove my brother-in-law's X5 40d a few times and it was truly awful one-up. There was a lot of harshness from the rear which had newly replaced airbags courtesy of BMW. It might've been great with that suspension on a backroad blast but then its not something I'd feel comfortable kicking hard down a backroad. It felt much better when I loaded it up with bags of topsoil and some turf. Really, apart from ease of access - and being a shortarse that wasn't great either especially with the token sidesteps (lethally slippery when wet) - and the slightly improved view I just don't see the point in a luxury and 'sporty' tank. |
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 22, 2020 11:31:23 GMT
Neither do I normally. But I would really have appreciated a 4x4 over the summer. And since I'm not rich enough to own multiple cars, I do now appreciate the Swiss Army knife approach.
I don't need it to be actively sporty. I just want it to be handsome, comfortable, plush and well-made, whilst also being fast, decent-enough to drive (ride, handling etc), and interesting-sounding. Is that so difficult?
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Sept 22, 2020 11:51:21 GMT
It seems to me that everyone (and I include myself) is anti-SUV for a whole host of reasons until they actually get one and then they become converted. If we were to have only one car it would be a SUV.
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 22, 2020 12:32:13 GMT
Quite so.
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Post by ChrisM on Sept 22, 2020 13:00:33 GMT
Neither do I normally. But I would really have appreciated a 4x4 over the summer. And since I'm not rich enough to own multiple cars, I do now appreciate the Swiss Army knife approach. I don't need it to be actively sporty. I just want it to be handsome, comfortable, plush and well-made, whilst also being fast, decent-enough to drive (ride, handling etc), and interesting-sounding. Is that so difficult? That seems to narrow it down to an i-Pace or F-Pace |
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Post by Martin on Sept 22, 2020 13:04:20 GMT
Neither do I normally. But I would really have appreciated a 4x4 over the summer. And since I'm not rich enough to own multiple cars, I do now appreciate the Swiss Army knife approach. I don't need it to be actively sporty. I just want it to be handsome, comfortable, plush and well-made, whilst also being fast, decent-enough to drive (ride, handling etc), and interesting-sounding. Is that so difficult? That seems to narrow it down to an i-Pace or F-Pace I was thinking that sounded like an Alpina B3/B5 Estate. |
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Post by Andy C on Sept 22, 2020 13:08:48 GMT
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Post by michael on Sept 22, 2020 13:27:07 GMT
I don't need it to be actively sporty. I just want it to be handsome, comfortable, plush and well-made, whilst also being fast, decent-enough to drive (ride, handling etc), and interesting-sounding. Is that so difficult?Yes, clearly. It comes down to where you're prepared to compromise but the variable you leave out is cost. If money were no object (you'd have several cars...) I suspect you'd likely go for a Macan so I suppose you need to decide what you're prepared to compromise with one of those. In terms of handsomeness and interesting sound you may be living in the past. |
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Post by Martin on Sept 22, 2020 13:58:20 GMT
I don't need it to be actively sporty. I just want it to be handsome, comfortable, plush and well-made, whilst also being fast, decent-enough to drive (ride, handling etc), and interesting-sounding. Is that so difficult?Yes, clearly. It comes down to where you're prepared to compromise but the variable you leave out is cost. If money were no object (you'd have several cars...) I suspect you'd likely go for a Macan so I suppose you need to decide what you're prepared to compromise with one of those. In terms of handsomeness and interesting sound you may be living in the past. Agreed. Trying to get everything in one car is very difficult, no matter the budget, so you will need figure out which one of your requirements can give a little. Have you agreed a budget yet and seen how that compares to what you're looking at? |
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Post by Roadrunner on Sept 22, 2020 14:20:35 GMT
That seems to narrow it down to an i-Pace or F-Pace I was thinking that sounded like an Alpina B3/B5 Estate. I was thinking it sounded like a Mercedes E350 estate. |
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Post by johnc on Sept 22, 2020 14:24:17 GMT
I think the X3M40i punches above its weight in this class but residuals might let it down against the Macan on PCP monthly payments. On the other hand it is likely to be a good bit cheaper with lower rate finance so might work.
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Post by Martin on Sept 22, 2020 14:36:58 GMT
I think the X3M40i punches above its weight in this class but residuals might let it down against the Macan on PCP monthly payments. On the other hand it is likely to be a good bit cheaper with lower rate finance so might work. I'd guess that it would be quite a bit cheaper despite the residuals not being as good, thanks to a big discount and lower APR. A near £70k Macan could well be over £700 a month even with a £10k deposit, so £900+ a month in total over 4 years. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 15:13:28 GMT
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Post by johnc on Sept 22, 2020 15:30:45 GMT
How is an iPace interesting sounding? Just try one and you'll find it a remarkably involving car to drive. I agree it doesn't sound like a 5, 6 or 8 pot! |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2020 16:20:12 GMT
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 22, 2020 18:10:25 GMT
I think the X3M40i punches above its weight in this class but residuals might let it down against the Macan on PCP monthly payments. On the other hand it is likely to be a good bit cheaper with lower rate finance so might work. I'd guess that it would be quite a bit cheaper despite the residuals not being as good, thanks to a big discount and lower APR. A near £70k Macan could well be over £700 a month even with a £10k deposit, so £900+ a month in total over 4 years. Yes, the Macan PCP quote was £700-ish. An X3 M40i would make lots of sense. Pretty much the same engine in a more practical and relatively handsome shape, and it would be considerably cheaper. What counts against it is being "yet another BMW" as Mrs RT would put it. Even I rather fancy a change of brand at this point. Nothing against BMW but I'm not actually a particular BMW fanboy, yet I've driven a BMW as my main car since 2009 and have owned a BMW of some description continually since 2005. It's true that they have made lots of cars that I like but equally so have plenty of other marques. Had the cost been broadly equal, I think we would have bought an S5 Sportback last time around rather than the 4GC. |
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Post by Martin on Sept 22, 2020 18:41:26 GMT
I'd guess that it would be quite a bit cheaper despite the residuals not being as good, thanks to a big discount and lower APR. A near £70k Macan could well be over £700 a month even with a £10k deposit, so £900+ a month in total over 4 years. Yes, the Macan PCP quote was £700-ish. An X3 M40i would make lots of sense. Pretty much the same engine in a more practical and relatively handsome shape, and it would be considerably cheaper. What counts against it is being "yet another BMW" as Mrs RT would put it. Even I rather fancy a change of brand at this point. Nothing against BMW but I'm not actually a particular BMW fanboy, yet I've driven a BMW as my main car since 2009 and have owned a BMW of some description continually since 2005. It's true that they have made lots of cars that I like but equally so have plenty of other marques. Had the cost been broadly equal, I think we would have bought an S5 Sportback last time around rather than the 4GC. I thought so. You could probably man maths a couple of £k equity into the cost, but over £900 a month for a mid spec Macan does feel like an awful lot, can’t be far off double what the GC costs. It’s the amount interest that does it, which must be getting on for £10k? |
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