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Post by johnc on Jan 15, 2020 15:36:11 GMT
I'm not sure if this should be here or in the YouTube thread but I found it interesting:
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Post by michael on Jan 15, 2020 16:41:59 GMT
I saw one of those Mercedes on the back of a trailer heading south on the A19 last week, I wonder if it was that one?
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Post by Ben on Jan 15, 2020 17:21:10 GMT
Funnily enough I just finished writing my Audi e-tron feature story.
I wouldn't do that to an EV though. For me I'll just plug it in whenever I have to stop and if there's a charging point nearby. It's like my phone. I very seldom let it drain till it's empty.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 18:03:33 GMT
I watched a vid where they were taking Tesla to task over their claims for massive towing capacity because of their cars' huge torque figures. They took a Tesla X out with a trailer attached and the battery was almost flat after an hour or so of driving.
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Post by racingteatray on Jan 15, 2020 18:11:09 GMT
But if you are travelling long distance, you are usually pressed for time, meaning stopping to charge up is an embuggerance.
For example, we recently drove back to London from my in-laws in Italy, via a stopover to ski near Mont Blanc. That's a distance of 1,100 miles. By the results from that video, in the Tesla, we'd have needed to stop to re-charge three times. In the Merc or E-tron, five re-charging stops would have required,
As it was, we only needed to stop for fuel twice (and used less than 2.5 tankfuls of petrol).
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Post by ChrisM on Jan 15, 2020 18:12:22 GMT
I'm not sure if this should be here or in the YouTube thread but I found it interesting: Funnily enough, I watched that last evening....... Electric cars still have a long way to go, and not being able to push one 30 yards to a charger is plain stupid. Love the idea of an extension lead borrowed from the pub, though !
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Post by michael on Jan 15, 2020 18:24:50 GMT
But if you are travelling long distance, you are usually pressed for time, meaning stopping to charge up is an embuggerance. For example, we recently drove back to London from my in-laws in Italy, via a stopover to ski near Mont Blanc. That's a distance of 1,100 miles. By the results from that video, in the Tesla, we'd have needed to stop to re-charge three times. In the Merc or E-tron, five re-charging stops would have required, As it was, we only needed to stop for fuel twice (and used less than 2.5 tankfuls of petrol). I wouldn't even make it so far as Kent to visit the inlaws. There's no way I can hang about for a half hour with the dogs in the car waiting for it to charge - assuming a charger is available and that they work.
I don't see electric cars as being the answer until batteries make a lot of progress.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 18:35:17 GMT
I'm not sure if this should be here or in the YouTube thread but I found it interesting: Funnily enough, I watched that last evening....... Electric cars still have a long way to go, and not being able to push one 30 yards to a charger is plain stupid. Love the idea of an extension lead borrowed from the pub, though ! You didn't watch the bit at the end then?
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Post by racingteatray on Jan 15, 2020 18:39:59 GMT
I wouldn't even make it so far as Kent to visit the inlaws. There's no way I can hang about for a half hour with the dogs in the car waiting for it to charge - assuming a charger is available and that they work.
I don't see electric cars as being the answer until batteries make a lot of progress.
That reminds me that I finally found Mottingham the other day and realised I had been driving past it for years without noticing, as it is on my route out of London to the Eurotunnel. I was amused to see my sat nav highlighting a particularly unappealing-sounding waterway called the "Quaggy River".
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Post by michael on Jan 15, 2020 18:53:56 GMT
They don’t live there anymore, thankfully. Not the nicest part of the world.
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Post by ChrisM on Jan 15, 2020 22:20:15 GMT
Funnily enough, I watched that last evening....... Electric cars still have a long way to go, and not being able to push one 30 yards to a charger is plain stupid. Love the idea of an extension lead borrowed from the pub, though ! You didn't watch the bit at the end then? Yes, but if you are on your own, you can't sit in the car and push it at the same time
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Post by Tim on Jan 16, 2020 9:48:47 GMT
We stopped at Tebay services last year and parked near the Tesla Supercharger points (which are at the furthest away bit of the carpark). Someone had their Model S plugged in and as we were hanging around for a while with my Bro in laws dogs we got to see the recharging in action. It was already plugged in when we arrived (and parked badly too!) and was silent but over the space of a few minutes a fan started blowing and got to the point where I was half expecting the car to take off. I imagine it could be quite alarming and in a residential setting very intrusive.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 14:40:38 GMT
Depends if it was the car or the charger, doesn't it? I'd've thunk that if it was the latter then they wouldn't install them near houses...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 14:51:19 GMT
You didn't watch the bit at the end then? Yes, but if you are on your own, you can't sit in the car and push it at the same time It wasn't real world test though, was it? Anyone in the real world would charge the car back up before it ran totally flat, the same as people don't run out of other fuels and then push their cars to the petrol station just because they can. There's also the fact that they took that generator and then never used it. TBF, though, I think they should've just ran the cars until they said 0 miles left. I'm sure the ranges would have been an awful lot lower than claimed in a lot of cases. The Kia was the most impressive one in a lot of respects, as it did 90% of its claimed range and was the cheapest. Shame it's no looker.
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Post by johnc on Jan 16, 2020 15:50:41 GMT
Depends if it was the car or the charger, doesn't it? I'd've thunk that if it was the latter then they wouldn't install them near houses... It's the fans on the car cooling the batteries down due to the speed of the charge - hope they are good quality fans otherwise a lot of these will end up as smoldering wrecks!
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Post by Tim on Jan 16, 2020 15:54:14 GMT
Depends if it was the car or the charger, doesn't it? I'd've thunk that if it was the latter then they wouldn't install them near houses... It's the fans on the car cooling the batteries down due to the speed of the charge - hope they are good quality fans otherwise a lot of these will end up as smoldering wrecks! This, it was definitely the car. They operate at some force, if you had a supercharger installed at home then you'd never have to worry about autumnal leaves settling on your driveway.
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Post by johnc on Jan 16, 2020 15:56:27 GMT
What I took from the test was that for most people, a realistic range is 180 to 200 miles which for a lot of people is all they will ever need. However if I am taking a trip to Nottingham to see a client or even driving through to St Andrews and back, I will need to stop and charge up which to be blunt would be a pain in the neck unless I could get a fast charger but there is no guarantee of that and as more electric cars take to the road, less and less chance of finding one free. Like Tim, I have been in Teebay and of the perhaps 10 chargers, I have often seen only 2 or 3 occupied. However one time we visited they were all full and this will become much more the norm.
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Post by Tim on Jan 16, 2020 16:08:02 GMT
Electric ferries as well now:- www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50233206Reading the article I can't help but wonder why the ferry has to wait to get to port before it recharges. Surely it should have some solar panels and a few small wind turbines on board to help it along the way? There's plenty of space on a ship after all. I remember reading an article about the V Bombers and they all had (along with many other aircraft, I'm sure) a ram air operated generator that popped out of the fuselage if the engines failed and would allow electrical power to continue to be supplied to the aircraft enabling it to still be controlled as it needed the electrical power for the flight controls. Yet in 2020 an electric ferry apparently would need to be towed to harbour (probably by a diesel powered tug) if its batteries ran dry?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 16:21:19 GMT
It's the fans on the car cooling the batteries down due to the speed of the charge - hope they are good quality fans otherwise a lot of these will end up as smoldering wrecks! This, it was definitely the car. They operate at some force, if you had a supercharger installed at home then you'd never have to worry about autumnal leaves settling on your driveway. You'd need to have a 3 phase supply at your house capable of delivering hundreds of amps. A large farm might have something like that and they're usually far away from their neighbours. The average house's single phase service fuse wouldn't feed one and the batteries in the car wouldn't get as warm on the domestic overnight trickle chargers.
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Post by johnc on Jan 16, 2020 16:23:48 GMT
Yet in 2020 an electric ferry apparently would need to be towed to harbour (probably by a diesel powered tug) if its batteries ran dry? It would just end up on the rocks because with no power there is no radio and no diesel tug!
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Post by Tim on Jan 16, 2020 17:15:18 GMT
Yet in 2020 an electric ferry apparently would need to be towed to harbour (probably by a diesel powered tug) if its batteries ran dry? It would just end up on the rocks because with no power there is no radio and no diesel tug! So its an environmental catastrophe waiting to happen yet they're busy congratulating themselves for doing half a job!
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Post by michael on Jan 16, 2020 17:43:42 GMT
What I took from the test was that for most people, a realistic range is 180 to 200 miles which for a lot of people is all they will ever need. However if I am taking a trip to Nottingham to see a client or even driving through to St Andrews and back, I will need to stop and charge up which to be blunt would be a pain in the neck unless I could get a fast charger but there is no guarantee of that and as more electric cars take to the road, less and less chance of finding one free. Like Tim, I have been in Teebay and of the perhaps 10 chargers, I have often seen only 2 or 3 occupied. However one time we visited they were all full and this will become much more the norm. I've now watched the video and I'm less impressed by electric than ever. I never realised they lost so much power overnight, for example. So, I could drive to Manchester airport in an electric car but if I left it there whilst I was on holiday for ten days I could expect it to have drained 40% of the battery parked up? So on return I'd have to call the AA as I doubt leaving it in a charging bay all that time would go down well. This isn't something I do often but it seems range anxiety sums up the stress of owning an electric car as you worry about a range of things you were never troubled with before.
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Post by johnc on Jan 16, 2020 18:30:19 GMT
What I took from the test was that for most people, a realistic range is 180 to 200 miles which for a lot of people is all they will ever need. However if I am taking a trip to Nottingham to see a client or even driving through to St Andrews and back, I will need to stop and charge up which to be blunt would be a pain in the neck unless I could get a fast charger but there is no guarantee of that and as more electric cars take to the road, less and less chance of finding one free. Like Tim, I have been in Teebay and of the perhaps 10 chargers, I have often seen only 2 or 3 occupied. However one time we visited they were all full and this will become much more the norm. I've now watched the video and I'm less impressed by electric than ever. I never realised they lost so much power overnight, for example. So, I could drive to Manchester airport in an electric car but if I left it there whilst I was on holiday for ten days I could expect it to have drained 40% of the battery parked up? So on return I'd have to call the AA as I doubt leaving it in a charging bay all that time would go down well. This isn't something I do often but it seems range anxiety sums up the stress of owning an electric car as you worry about a range of things you were never troubled with before.
However I have client No3 just placed an order for a Taycan, I have one has bought (and might already have) and e-tron and one who is waiting for the e-tron GT. The lure of 100% write off against profits in year 1 and no benefit in kind is a massive incentive.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Jan 17, 2020 10:30:55 GMT
What I took from the test was that for most people, a realistic range is 180 to 200 miles which for a lot of people is all they will ever need. However if I am taking a trip to Nottingham to see a client or even driving through to St Andrews and back, I will need to stop and charge up which to be blunt would be a pain in the neck unless I could get a fast charger but there is no guarantee of that and as more electric cars take to the road, less and less chance of finding one free. Like Tim, I have been in Teebay and of the perhaps 10 chargers, I have often seen only 2 or 3 occupied. However one time we visited they were all full and this will become much more the norm. I've now watched the video and I'm less impressed by electric than ever. I never realised they lost so much power overnight, for example. So, I could drive to Manchester airport in an electric car but if I left it there whilst I was on holiday for ten days I could expect it to have drained 40% of the battery parked up? So on return I'd have to call the AA as I doubt leaving it in a charging bay all that time would go down well. This isn't something I do often but it seems range anxiety sums up the stress of owning an electric car as you worry about a range of things you were never troubled with before.
I doubt you can extrapolate the small amount lost overnight after a full charge to cover a 2 week holiday period. You're assuming the unused batteries lose charge linearly. You might be right but I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that.
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Post by scouse on Jan 17, 2020 15:01:40 GMT
Electric ferries as well now:- www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50233206Reading the article I can't help but wonder why the ferry has to wait to get to port before it recharges. Surely it should have some solar panels and a few small wind turbines on board to help it along the way? There's plenty of space on a ship after all. I remember reading an article about the V Bombers and they all had (along with many other aircraft, I'm sure) a ram air operated generator that popped out of the fuselage if the engines failed and would allow electrical power to continue to be supplied to the aircraft enabling it to still be controlled as it needed the electrical power for the flight controls.
Yet in 2020 an electric ferry apparently would need to be towed to harbour (probably by a diesel powered tug) if its batteries ran dry? The V bombers do go quite a bit quicker than your average ferry though...
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Post by Tim on Jan 17, 2020 15:30:05 GMT
Electric ferries as well now:- www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50233206Reading the article I can't help but wonder why the ferry has to wait to get to port before it recharges. Surely it should have some solar panels and a few small wind turbines on board to help it along the way? There's plenty of space on a ship after all. I remember reading an article about the V Bombers and they all had (along with many other aircraft, I'm sure) a ram air operated generator that popped out of the fuselage if the engines failed and would allow electrical power to continue to be supplied to the aircraft enabling it to still be controlled as it needed the electrical power for the flight controls.
Yet in 2020 an electric ferry apparently would need to be towed to harbour (probably by a diesel powered tug) if its batteries ran dry? The V bombers do go quite a bit quicker than your average ferry though... Very good. I reckon a decent North Sea gale could help spin some shipboard wind turbines pretty quickly though, at least it would add a bit of extra juice to the batteries to help limit range anxiety on something that weighs a few thousand tonnes (I mean the ferry, not any of the pure electric cars that are scarily heavy ).
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Post by bryan on Jan 18, 2020 13:16:20 GMT
The loss of charge while parked is a concern. I had 11miles range on the Merc when I parked it at the station, 12hours later when I got back to the car it was 8 miles (and leaving the carpark 6 miles....)
So I don't trust the battery element, useful when running on fumes to get to station but wouldn't want to rely on it.
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Post by humphreythepug on Jan 19, 2020 9:12:30 GMT
Interesting video.
The loss of charge thing is odd as I'm pretty sure this doesn't happen to the ZOE, if it does I've never noticed and I have more than enough experience of them.
Interesting too as a 40kWh ZOE will do 200 miles on a charge, shame they didn't have the new 50kWh ZOE to test, even if it would have been a LHD version. ZOE is the most popular electric car in Europe so it should have been there.
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Post by ChrisM on Jan 19, 2020 17:42:48 GMT
I find the reported loss of charge when parked a bit concerning too, I wonder if there was something wrong?
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Post by michael on Jan 19, 2020 18:13:51 GMT
I’d assume it’s systems running in the background rather than general attrition but it’s something if not given much thought.
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