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Post by ChrisM on Jan 22, 2024 21:53:35 GMT
There was an article recently (I thinki t was on YouTube) where the ugly styling was attributed to the demand in China. Thing is, in the overall scheme of developing a nw car, the cost opf an additional mould tool for a different front bumper plus different shaped lights etc, is negligible. So why not 2 front ends, one being China-specific?
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Post by Big Blue on Jan 22, 2024 22:19:23 GMT
Yeah I am also stunned as to why, in the world of plastic moulded body parts, there can’t be market-specific variations. Having said that, regardless of national styles and tastes I see no reason for the existence of the front end of the BMW i7. Nobody can possibly want to look at that, whether on the driveway, in their garage or merely awaiting the arrival of their private hire.
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Post by johnc on Jan 23, 2024 9:32:07 GMT
Prices have gone silly. Hot hatches can be £50-60k, £100k for an M3, it’s easy to spend close to £100k on a Boxster etc. It doesn’t seem that long ago (nearly 6 years, time flies) I paid £55k for a 1,300 mile nicely FG’d 750i and that felt like a lot of money. You just need to look at the used car prices to see that the buying public also think that new prices have reached stupid heights. M3s and M4s selling for £30K/£40K less than list after a year to 18 months, 8 series half price after 18 months, 23 plate RS4 and RS5 at £20K+ off list. Back in the 1990's and early 2000's private buyers hardly ever bought new because prices were too high and the fleet buyers kept the production lines going. Now that the tax costs of having a non EV company car are so high and company cars are far less common, it's hard to see how the manufacturers are going to be able to maintain production. Maybe it's just a UK problem in which case the foreign manufacturers are likely to be quite happy to hang us out to dry. |
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Post by chipbutty on Jan 23, 2024 9:47:52 GMT
I think list price on EVs is generally not a consideration in these purchases as it seems largely disconnected from the transaction price for the end user (in this country).
- If it's run as a company car, the company will get a deal through a fleet supplier and the user pays a pittance in BIK
- If it's put through a business, then there will be the usual allowable tax chicanery (although Harry makes a good point that a tipping point will be reached soon).
- If it's available through salary sacrifice, the end user will get the benefit of the tax saving and some discount pass through from the provider.
- If it's a standard private purchase - then it will likely be offered on a heavily subsidised lease or PCP deal if customers aren't biting.
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Post by Tim on Jan 23, 2024 10:23:09 GMT
Are these new prices going to cause the manufacturers an issue?
Assuming the majority of cars are now taken on a PCP are the payments for, say, an M4 reflecting a price drop of £30-40k after 18 months and presumably a further significant drop for the remainder of a typically 3 year deal?
I presume not as the buyers would probably just walk away but that'll leave a financial hole that I assume the manufacturer/importer has to fill.
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Post by johnc on Jan 23, 2024 10:36:47 GMT
Are these new prices going to cause the manufacturers an issue? Assuming the majority of cars are now taken on a PCP are the payments for, say, an M4 reflecting a price drop of £30-40k after 18 months and presumably a further significant drop for the remainder of a typically 3 year deal? I presume not as the buyers would probably just walk away but that'll leave a financial hole that I assume the manufacturer/importer has to fill. A new M4 on a PCP used to be under £1,000/mth and it is now closer to £1,200/mth so it is either interest rate related (although currently doing 4.9%apr) or they are taking in to account the huge fall in value - they reckon the value of a £90K M4 will be just over £33K in 4 years |
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Post by Tim on Jan 23, 2024 10:44:02 GMT
Ok, I hadn't looked at current payment rates.
That's still eating into the margin to fund the interest though.
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Post by PetrolEd on Jan 23, 2024 15:52:30 GMT
There are already sub 3 year old M4's with less then 10,000miles on for under 50K.
I know they are hideous but when a 3 year old M3 touring hits 50K they will be hard to ignore. I'd rather an Alpina B3 but the monstrous depreciation of the M3/4 doesn't seem to have much of an impact on Alpina depreciation.
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Post by johnc on Jan 23, 2024 16:34:03 GMT
I think the seats on the M3/M4 are going to become an issue. It appears that the carbon buckets are needed to retain value/make them saleable but people who use them as a daily and don't just track them find they are a pain in the a***.
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Post by Tim on Jan 23, 2024 16:47:17 GMT
They look more like they'd be a pain in the bollocks!
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Post by Martin on Jan 23, 2024 16:51:14 GMT
There are already sub 3 year old M4's with less then 10,000miles on for under 50K. I know they are hideous but when a 3 year old M3 touring hits 50K they will be hard to ignore. I'd rather an Alpina B3 but the monstrous depreciation of the M3/4 doesn't seem to have much of an impact on Alpina depreciation. That should make them very easy to ignore!  I've moved on from hideous to unnecessarily ugly, maybe by the time the Touring is under £50k the looks might be a bit more acceptable. It's getting more and more difficult, but I really don't ever want to buy a car that fails to make me 'look back'. |
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Post by bryan on Jan 24, 2024 16:56:29 GMT
I was looking at G20 shape M4s even the last 20plate cars can be had for 30k. Saw a nice main dealer one for 33k.
That is serious depreciation given they were pushing £70k new.
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Post by racingteatray on Jan 25, 2024 10:33:30 GMT
I was looking at G20 shape M4s even the last 20plate cars can be had for 30k. Saw a nice main dealer one for 33k. That is serious depreciation given they were pushing £70k new. You mean F30-shape... But yes. I do love the design of them. But for my money a 440i is a better car more of the time for most people. It has a nicer-sounding engine as well and you don't suffer the M tax. |
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Post by bryan on Jan 25, 2024 11:55:19 GMT
I was looking at G20 shape M4s even the last 20plate cars can be had for 30k. Saw a nice main dealer one for 33k. That is serious depreciation given they were pushing £70k new. You mean F30-shape... But yes. I do love the design of them. But for my money a 440i is a better car more of the time for most people. It has a nicer-sounding engine as well and you don't suffer the M tax. If only they did a 440i with a full merino interior....I can't find any |
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Post by Martin on Jan 25, 2024 15:29:03 GMT
You mean F30-shape... But yes. I do love the design of them. But for my money a 440i is a better car more of the time for most people. It has a nicer-sounding engine as well and you don't suffer the M tax. If only they did a 440i with a full merino interior....I can't find any They did, but they are super rare. There were a couple of unregistered ones when we were looking at cars for Lindsay in early 2018. They were well spaced and under £40k! |
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Post by racingteatray on Jan 25, 2024 16:02:27 GMT
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Post by bryan on Jan 25, 2024 17:03:18 GMT
A rare find indeed, but even then not on the tops of the doors like the M4...
Find me a snapper rocks blue 440i convertible, with full Merino and I'll be there!
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Post by Tim on Jan 25, 2024 17:07:59 GMT
The driver's seat looks dirty and the suspension is sitting a bit high. |
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Jan 25, 2024 17:31:08 GMT
The driver's seat looks dirty and the suspension is sitting a bit high. XDrives always sit a bit higher. |
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Post by Tim on Jan 26, 2024 11:07:50 GMT
10mm from memory
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Post by racingteatray on Jan 26, 2024 11:43:04 GMT
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Post by Martin on Jan 26, 2024 11:55:28 GMT
Was a leather Dashboard an option alongside Full Merino? I'm not sure, but that would explain the difference. |
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Post by Tim on Jan 26, 2024 12:37:50 GMT
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Post by Big Blue on Jan 26, 2024 12:48:05 GMT
Cat S is written off for uneconomic repair costs but no structural damage. So if lots of panels and the windows are smashed with airbags deployed likely a Cat S.
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Post by Martin on Jan 26, 2024 13:13:51 GMT
Or in the case of that car, Shit looking bodykit! |
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Post by Tim on Jan 26, 2024 16:35:55 GMT
I think that's the full M Performance kit for the estate.
There were a lot 335ds for sale with that kit when this car was new.
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Post by Martin on Jan 26, 2024 16:38:01 GMT
I think that's the full M Performance kit for the estate. There were a lot 335ds for sale with that kit when this car was new. It completely ruins the car imho. At least is was before they lost the plot with their exhaust upgrades! |
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Post by johnc on Jan 26, 2024 17:33:54 GMT
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Post by Martin on Jan 26, 2024 17:42:29 GMT
That was nice until I got to the last 2 pictures. Only 1 service recorded back in 2018. As the advert says it has FSH then it might have been done by someone who couldn't update the car (still not great), but then there's the running in service that was completed 5,600 after it should have been! Shame as it's a lovely spec. |
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Jan 26, 2024 18:43:54 GMT
Running in service or running in check? Maybe not an issue.
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