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Post by johnc on Sept 27, 2021 12:02:57 GMT
I didn't want to take an other thread off track so I thought I would start this one.
I buy logo golf balls to hand out to clients, give as prizes at some charity events and hand out when I take clients golfing. Because they are properly logo'd I can recover the VAT and also deduct the cost as advertising.
I was given some balls (Pro Plus) recently made by a company in Germany (Vice) and was very impressed with how they felt and performed, so I thought I would look at the possibility of ordering some with our logo. The ordering process is very easy, as is uploading and placing the logo and the price is extremely competitive.
As a business to business transaction, the seller should not charge me German VAT and on receipt I would either have to pay UK VAT (which I could recover) or the VAT would not need to be paid and I would just treat it as a Reverse Charge on my VAT Return. Either way I would get the balls excluding VAT.
Unfortunately the German site did not allow this option and all the prices included German VAT so I contacted their help line and tried to get it resolved. In the end, I ended up with a senior manager who said this was all the fault of Brexit and they could not remove the VAT. I asked him if he would charge VAT if the goods were going to USA and he said no he wouldn't but the UK was different because of the UK's rules after Brexit. I have checked and double checked with HMRC and they confirm there is no reason for the Germans to charge VAT. When I spoke to the Germans again, they said they had to charge VAT unless the order was over £600 ex VAT (nearly double what I would normally spend). I asked them where the £600 limit came from and they said it was the UK's rule and was all because of Brexit. I checked my guidance again and phoned HMRC and there is no mention of £600. My only thought is that it may be the freight forwarders who won't deal with VAT free exports unless they are of higher value i.e. over £600.
I have decided not to order just now but to leave it until the Spring but I wonder if there is a lot of anti UK/blame Brexit sentiment, running around in Europe just now which is acting as a barrier to trade. At this rate I will just be ordering the normal Titleist (American) balls at a net price after VAT roughly equivalent to the German balls including VAT, just because it is easier.
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Post by ChrisM on Sept 27, 2021 14:31:48 GMT
I do wonder how many foreign governments are putting pressure on their truck drivers etc NOT to return to Britain to help us out, out of spite for us voting to leave Europe
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2021 15:14:14 GMT
There have been issues with european firms for a while. Ever since the vote in fact, in CAD for example, many German (in particular) companies just closed their sites off to anyone based in the UK and they have remained that way.
Having said that, many specialist VW parts companies in the US will not accept business from UK owners. We have to wait until a UK dealer goes over there and fills a container, anything less is not worthwhile doing.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Sept 27, 2021 15:30:43 GMT
I have decided not to order just now but to leave it until the Spring but I wonder if there is a lot of anti UK/blame Brexit sentiment, running around in Europe just now which is acting as a barrier to trade. At this rate I will just be ordering the normal Titleist (American) balls at a net price after VAT roughly equivalent to the German balls including VAT, just because it is easier. Yes there is and companies are making a lot of it up as they go along and just saying it's down to Brexit. They're trying it on, basically. Whilst the Uk has lost access to the European free market, when it's easier and less red tape to do business with the US and Brazil, of all places, you know this is all about punishment and not about finding a mutually beneficial way forward. |
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 27, 2021 16:01:55 GMT
He’s lying.
I had the brakes serviced in Czech and didn’t pay vat even though I was there in Zlin. It was under £600.
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Post by PG on Sept 27, 2021 17:13:25 GMT
Just take your business elsewhere. If the German company can't be arsed to deal with you then it's their loss. Or you could tell the German that you are not in the UK. You're in the People's Republic of Scotland.
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 28, 2021 13:53:04 GMT
Add it to the almost infinite list of consequences they omitted to put on the side of a bus.
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Post by garry on Sept 28, 2021 15:06:10 GMT
Add it to the almost infinite list of consequences they omitted to put on the side of a bus. Are you suggesting they should have written "German golf ball manufacturers will lie and try it on" |
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Post by Roadsterstu on Sept 28, 2021 15:10:09 GMT
Just take your business elsewhere. If the German company can't be arsed to deal with you then it's their loss. Or you could tell the German that you are not in the UK. You're in the People's Republic of Scotland. And tell them it is clearly bollocks and they can shove their golf balls up each other's arses and fart them out at speed. Translate that into German, just to be kind. |
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Post by Roadsterstu on Sept 28, 2021 15:13:19 GMT
Add it to the almost infinite list of consequences they omitted to put on the side of a bus. Yeah and maybe birds will start flying upside down or backwards and that, too, can be blamed on Brexit  |
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 28, 2021 15:47:36 GMT
Add it to the almost infinite list of consequences they omitted to put on the side of a bus. Are you suggesting they should have written "German golf ball manufacturers will lie and try it on" No but suppliers that used to have the path of least resistance dealing with British clients that now can't be arsed to jump through hoops or do other paperwork or change IT systems they didn't have to until Brexit came along is a consequence of Brexit. |
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 29, 2021 13:08:15 GMT
This ^^.
It's sort of the whole point of a common market for goods and services.
But the necessary number of people to win a vote in a referendum either deemed that expendable or never understood its value in the first place.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Sept 29, 2021 13:31:33 GMT
I think the ease goods can be shipped to and from the US, China, Brazil etc, compared to the "barriers" that are now in place between the UK and Europe suggest that this is not about the UK having left the Common Market and finding traditional trade barriers in place that are relatively easy to overcome in a digital world, and more about making it as difficult as possible - in the way a spurned wife makes it as difficult as possible for an separated father to see his kids, to the detriment of all. As in all divorces either party can make it as easy or as difficult to continue a relationship in the future.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2021 14:08:41 GMT
Making life deliberately hard is a kettle of fish more than not making it simple. Quite a few eu companies are going out of their way to do just that. Sour grapes and childishness.
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Post by garry on Sept 29, 2021 15:10:08 GMT
I’m sure this sort of nonsense will sort itself out quickly enough. Not many businesses will be daft enough to put barriers in the way of customers for very long, or they’ll die. With John’s example, I’m sure that he’ll either find another organisation willing to meet his needs or the original firm will get their act together when they spot a hole in the their p&l.
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Post by johnc on Oct 4, 2021 11:33:49 GMT
We have just been told we are losing a client today: we have German/Dutch clients who have run several convenience stores extremely successfully over the years. They normally buy something that has potential and isn't doing too well (or the previous owner was doing much too much in cash) and turn it around into a much better and more profitable business.
They still haven't been granted permanent permission to stay and have to re-apply every 3 years. They are also concerned and upset at the pointed questions they face when they come back from Europe and are asked to prove they have the right to stay in the UK. They are tired of the uncertainty and tired of the feeling they no longer belong here so are moving back to mainland Europe. Their hardworking and totally honest practices are a big loss to the UK. No doubt the next owner of their shop will revert to style in the UK and put a load of cash in their pocket.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2021 11:38:18 GMT
That is our side of the stupid coin, we certainly have enough of that to go around.
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Post by Big Blue on Oct 4, 2021 12:18:06 GMT
They are also concerned and upset at the pointed questions they face when they come back from Europe and are asked to prove they have the right to stay in the UK. This was the biggest “fuck off” element to our return from a summer away. The first question the border staff asked was “do you have permanent right to remain?” BEFORE they checked her passport, which has the details in the chip. |
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Post by PG on Oct 4, 2021 12:27:21 GMT
They are also concerned and upset at the pointed questions they face when they come back from Europe and are asked to prove they have the right to stay in the UK. This was the biggest “fuck off” element to our return from a summer away. The first question the border staff asked was “do you have permanent right to remain?” BEFORE they checked her passport, which has the details in the chip. That just sounds rude or idle. I can't be arsed to check so I'll just ask you. Used to be that UK border people had that same perfect sarcasm that traffic policeman used to have. And they seemed to get who they needed. Now it all seems an exercise in box ticking, like so much else in government. Maybe they sent all the UK border force for training in the US, where they treat everyone like shit at the border. |
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