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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 14:03:20 GMT
Barker also concludes, in reference to the 720S's hydraulic rack, that the best electric setups are now just as good as a good hydraulic. Not an opinion I have read anywhere else.
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Post by Blarno on May 13, 2017 16:09:33 GMT
The Glacier Mint has an electro hydraulic rack and it feels no different to the regular hydraulic rack in my Stepdad's 93 Aero.
Maybe I'm just not enough of a driving hero?
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Post by LandieMark on May 13, 2017 20:46:31 GMT
Technology has moved on from the Corsa B electric rack. The TVR racks are no longer supported for refurb if the gears are worn and the common replacement is a Subaru hydraulic rack or Vauxhall electric. The advantage of the electric is that the assistance can be adjusted.
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Post by Ben on May 15, 2017 7:55:18 GMT
I stopped reading car mags of any description about three years ago. And bike mags. I am an informational vacuum. This. Car mags exist in a strange continuum where they're either deathly dull (Auto Express/Autocar), driving god Queef wheelsmith tomes (Evo) or wannabe middle class gentleman's rags a la GQ (Car). I've always held the view that journos are nothing more than paid opinion-givers. Their opinion is no more worthy than yours or mine, they're just possibly better and putting it into print. I generally don't read magazines of any sort now because all journos are cut from the same cloth, IMO. As 'one of them' I guess I should weigh in... You're broadly right that car writing (I hasten to call test drives 'journalism'. That's for news) swings wildly between two camps. The 'factual' ones like What Car (and actually most mags) are aimed at most car buyers who know squat about cars, so they basically need everything spelled out and dumbed down for them. It can be dull for enthusiasts to read but we're not really their main audience. Fancier rags like Evo and Top Gear and etc are more about the visual splendour of nice pictures and fancy writing. They're aimed at pretentious people who see their cars as complements to their expensive watches and yachts and what not. Sometimes they drive their cars but most of the time it's more likely parked at a mansion somewhere around the world. There's very little for middling enthusiasts for us, who care a bit more about cars but are not snooty folks. We are a minority and insignificant lot sadly. |
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2017 8:28:01 GMT
That really does sound like the grossest of simplifications.
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Post by michael on May 15, 2017 8:35:54 GMT
I'm afraid you're talking bollocks there Ben.
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Post by Ben on May 15, 2017 9:10:31 GMT
That really does sound like the grossest of simplifications. Well I try... |
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Post by Tim on May 15, 2017 13:06:26 GMT
In the McLaren comparison test John Barker refers to his 'second stint' at EVO.
Looks like he's back properly then. Good.
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Post by Sav on May 15, 2017 21:41:50 GMT
It would be good if Evo and other publications had racing drivers on a permanent basis to test these ever-faster hypercars and supercars. I was at Brands Hatch last week and a LaFerrari was driven by a racing driver for a demo run. Considering the ludicrous power and cornering abilities that such cars have; surely only racing drivers can truly reach the capabilities of them.
Reading about the McLaren 720S and its additional downforce has been fascinating across a number of different publications. However, it would be great to read the perspective of a GT3 driver who is used to handling high downforce and making the most out of various settings. Evo especially values track performance highly, so let’s see what the ultimate track drivers think. There are loads of retired racing drivers to choose from….
The racing driver wouldn’t need to have a dominating opinion, because the racer's view about the last few tenths on a track wouldn't tell the reader about road usability, comfort, refinement etc. However, it would be a perspective that even the best journalists couldn't offer.
In Evo I have previously enjoyed reading Marino Franchitti, and his brother was great to read as well. It was a shame that Dario couldn’t contribute to a greater degree.
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Post by PetrolEd on May 15, 2017 21:52:26 GMT
Most publications do have serious hands on staff that would embarrass most amateur racers. Thinking of the likes of Sutcliffe, Bovingdon and Meaden who are probably far better at summing up a "fast" car then a racing driver. Then you have the racing drivers who think all road cars are shit because its totally compromised on track and anything this side of an LMP couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding.
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Post by Sav on May 15, 2017 22:03:47 GMT
I’m not so sure about that. Take Chris Harris. He’s clearly a great driver in his own right, but he didn't exactly blitz the field in Blancpain at Silverstone. And that was in the Am class, not even the Pro class. The best “amateur” drivers in Blancpain and WEC are damn good, and the Pro drivers are sublime. Harris has been impressive for someone with little professional racing experience, and perhaps he would be great with more experience. However, an established professional would have an expectation and feel of downforce from various top-spec machinery, something that even the best journo's can't offer.
I especially say this because of the extra downforce that the fastest road cars now get. I liked what Evo did with Marino; he offered a professional perspective, not a summary on a particular car as a whole.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2017 7:41:12 GMT
Yes, I'm not convinced that most who rather fancy themselves, which includes several of the evo lot, are quite as over-rotatingly good as they think they might be. That said, I thought Sutcliffe usually acquitted himself well - I'm thinking of the Honda event where he did comparable times in a Type R to Button, and far from disgraced himself in an F1 car. But then he raced Tuscans in a previous life, I think.
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Post by Tim on May 16, 2017 10:45:10 GMT
You'd have to be quite specific when you were picking an ex-racing driver.
Plenty of 'top line' guys have been unimpressive in lower categories (Derek Warwick in BTCC for example).
Speaking as someone who probably wouldn't go on a track day I would find limited use of their comments no matter what.
I'd actually rather hear that a respected motoring journo had driven one of these after spending the previous few weeks exclusively driving something like a Golf GTI, that way their impressions might be more relevant.
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Post by PetrolEd on May 16, 2017 11:55:53 GMT
I’m not so sure about that. Take Chris Harris. He’s clearly a great driver in his own right, but he didn't exactly blitz the field in Blancpain at Silverstone. And that was in the Am class, not even the Pro class. The best “amateur” drivers in Blancpain and WEC are damn good, and the Pro drivers are sublime. Harris has been impressive for someone with little professional racing experience, and perhaps he would be great with more experience. However, an established professional would have an expectation and feel of downforce from various top-spec machinery, something that even the best journo's can't offer. I especially say this because of the extra downforce that the fastest road cars now get. I liked what Evo did with Marino; he offered a professional perspective, not a summary on a particular car as a whole. Hence I didn't mention Harris who was a long way off the pace of Sutcliffe when Autocar did a piece on the two of them a number of years ago.
Pro drivers don't give a shit about anything other than lap time. You could present them with the nastiest car known to man but if you could do a ring lap in under 6m 11 they'd think it great
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2017 12:25:15 GMT
Talking of 'ring laps, did you see that the record is now held by an electric car?
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Post by Blarno on May 16, 2017 12:57:00 GMT
It would be good if Evo and other publications had racing drivers on a permanent basis to test these ever-faster hypercars and supercars. It would work for Evo but please don't put it outside the confines of that wheelsmith magazine. If a car requires a racing driver to get the best out of it then the car is probably not remotely capable 100% of the time for anyone else. I'd much rather somebody who drives all sorts of cars puts it into context rather than the nauseating detail about how the front camber induces a slight hesitancy at the rear end when pulling 1.4g in low-radius corners etc etc etc. That would be turgid. This. A racing driver's idea of what makes a good road car is equal to a baker's idea of what makes a good sausage. |
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Post by johnc on May 17, 2017 11:55:39 GMT
This. A racing driver's idea of what makes a good road car is equal to a baker's idea of what makes a good sausage. Mmmmmm. A Roll and Sausage - A baker and butcher in perfect harmony! |
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Post by scouse on May 17, 2017 14:55:09 GMT
Yes, I'm not convinced that most who rather fancy themselves, which includes several of the evo lot, are quite as over-rotatingly good as they think they might be. That said, I thought Sutcliffe usually acquitted himself well - I'm thinking of the Honda event where he did comparable times in a Type R to Button, and far from disgraced himself in an F1 car. But then he raced Tuscans in a previous life, I think. Agreed. Remember the Autocar video of the Jaguar S-Type R with Antonio Pizzonia when he seemed to know long before the F1 driver did that the car was going to make the corner? John Barker raced Caterhams and Tuscans back in the Performance Car days, Richard Meaden races classics still. Some of the others seem to hang on to the bigger names coat tails in terms of writing. |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2017 8:10:38 GMT
I know this is going to sound puerile but, I got heartily sick of a certain magazine stating that this latest generation of American car was going to compete with the European brands on a level field and the last generation was so lacking in this or that so it failed. Only to say the same thing when the next gen came out. I note that tests between dissimilar spec cars can see the higher spec car win which strikes me as a pointless comparison. I also ask myself "When did I get so old"? Almost like the angry old men program, at least I think that is what it was called. I have Autocar from this week but I just got bored and picked one up.
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Post by Tim on May 19, 2017 10:31:12 GMT
I note that tests between dissimilar spec cars can see the higher spec car win which strikes me as a pointless comparison. CAR regularly do this in their short tests of 4 comparative vehicles. One of the worst included a Peugeot at around £23k and possibly an Evoque at £45k.
In addition the magazines helpfully include basic and 'as tested' prices. It's amazing how often a £50k basic car gets tested with £15-20k of options yet little is made of it. Surely you've got to assume that some of those extras will make the car drive differently? One of the worst offenders in this cost area are carbon brakes, now almost deemed essential by the mags if they're on the options list. However, it undoubtedly covers fancy optional suspension, etc Undoubtedly a lot of these options wouldn't be selected by a lot of normal people?
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