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Post by woofwoof on Aug 8, 2022 19:51:31 GMT
Hi all, maybe some people will remember me even though I've been a long time gone.
I've just turned 61 and still running a 19 year old 1.6 MX5 and a 13 year old Getz. I've been into cars as long as I can remember but have mostly gone for two seat soft tops but before I have to give up driving I think I have time for a bit more fun and a couple more including a 4x4 as I've never had one. Later if my health and mobility start to go I might have to go for another small hatchback but there might be time to enjoy a 4x4 and tick it off the list of experiences. Actually I may keep the Getz or the MX5 as well but I don't think both, we'll see.
I'd like to go for a LR product just because I like to buy British, maybe a Discovery Sport or an Evoque with the Ipace being an outside possibility. Money wise I'm ok. I retired 12 years ago and my money has tended to go down a manageable amount in recent years but when I turned 60 I started to receive a pension from my computer days and haven't had to dip into my savings since and now my money is actually increasing again so a car is doable but it'll probably be 2-3 years old as I'm a bit careful (tight) these days and don't really see the point in buying new when a lightly used one which has lost some value to depreciation might do me just as good.
It'll be an auto and petrol with an outside chance of electric as I'm curious but then again I'm worried that electric could be a disaster for the planet and maybe I should keep clear. I haven't test driven anything as I move sloooowly these days and don't want to waste anyone's time including my own until I'm a bit more sure what I want. Millage will be very low as I don't work and I/we walk a lot, maybe a few k a year.
So, advice from you experts would be appreciated. Sport v Evoque and views on a used Ipace.
Other than that. Nice to see some old names on the board but a few seem to be missing. Wherever they are I wish them well. I haven't worked in years but did get married to a rather nice Thai lady I met when still doing a bit of work. I spend a lot of my time caring for someone these days and it's a time consuming and demanding thing and my only real interests outside of that are married life, cars and I still also dabble in photography.
So experts... Views and opinions on what to go for and what to avoid will be appreciated.
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Post by Stuntman on Aug 8, 2022 20:12:01 GMT
Welcome back.
There are a few on here with first-hand experience of some of the cars you mention so I will leave it for them to comment regarding Evoque, I-Pace etc. These days I have a Toyota GR Yaris alongside an M3 and a Cayman, and the Yaris is an entirely different way to get 4WD fun. I think you'd like one, although it's not an auto and it's not British.
Congratulations on your marriage and I hope any mobility issues that you may have aren't restricting you too much.
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 8, 2022 20:35:02 GMT
Welcome back. There are a few on here with first-hand experience of some of the cars you mention so I will leave it for them to comment regarding Evoque, I-Pace etc. These days I have a Toyota GR Yaris alongside an M3 and a Cayman, and the Yaris is an entirely different way to get 4WD fun. I think you'd like one, although it's not an auto and it's not British. Congratulations on your marriage and I hope any mobility issues that you may have aren't restricting you too much. Is that the Cayman you had years ago or a new one? I have no issues yet, I'm still annoyingly fit and exercise most days but time comes for us all. I will need to get a wheel chair into any new car though but I can't see this as too much of a problem as one fits into my Getz no problem. |
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Post by Blarno on Aug 9, 2022 7:23:59 GMT
Alright Alan.
I hear nothing good about JLR products in relation to long term reliability, what about something Japanese or Eastern? Kias and Hyundais are some of the best looking and reliable 4WDs on the planet.
Anyway, I'm still here, but joined the dark side a few years back (Diesel, German, Auto)
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 9, 2022 8:32:27 GMT
Alright Alan. I hear nothing good about JLR products in relation to long term reliability, what about something Japanese or Eastern? Kias and Hyundais are some of the best looking and reliable 4WDs on the planet. Anyway, I'm still here, but joined the dark side a few years back (Diesel, German, Auto) There's three points to this really which are to try a 4x4 and a LR and to have a comfortable auto again so if it's going to be a Nissan it doesn't really tick all of the boxes. The LR sticking point might not make a lot of sense but I suppose it goes back to my childhood as my dad had a bit of a thing for LR's even though he never learned to drive and that maybe planted the seed and I've always sort of wanted one and as time is beginning to run out now might be the time. I asked a similar question on a photography forum and a couple of people did mention LR reliability and went on to point me at the German alternatives which when I checked were by a happy coincidence the only things to do worse than LR in the quality and reliability surveys. Some of the eastern marques are probably going to be better and would be an easy sell to the Mrs as she has an XTrail which she left with her family when she came here but to be honest I see no real appeal in owning one so if I don't get a LR I might not bother but then again I do take your point and just might go that way... Years back when I had the Elise I test drove a Scooby and it scared the bejezus out of me as there was just no feedback at all and it was like being sat at home playing a video game. Later I drove a Legacy but ended up getting a 4lts S Type instead. I've only had two automatics, SLK 230 and Jag S so another and combining that with it being a SUV and a Jag might be nice and I've sort of got used to having limited feedback driving the Getz which I inherited. Anyway, sorry for the long reply and you are being sensible and I will think about it. Just for fun here's my MX5 getting new tyres. Taken with a Takumar 50mm f1.4 which is very old.  |
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Post by Martin on Aug 9, 2022 9:26:27 GMT
Alright Alan. I hear nothing good about JLR products in relation to long term reliability, what about something Japanese or Eastern? Kias and Hyundais are some of the best looking and reliable 4WDs on the planet. Anyway, I'm still here, but joined the dark side a few years back (Diesel, German, Auto) Errrr…..that’s not true.  I’ve had over 2 years and nearly 30,000 miles with zero issues, that’s got to be something good surely? It’s certainly exceeded my expectations and has been a lot better than the 7 series, although to be fair that’s the only BMW I’ve had real issues with (oil and coolant leaks) and the service was excellent. Welcome back Alan. |
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Post by johnc on Aug 9, 2022 9:47:29 GMT
Hi Alan. We are 2 years into a 3 year i-Pace lease and with the exception of long distance driving, it has been fantastic. It is in the dealership today to get a new wheel under warranty but apart from that and a brake fluid and filter service 3 weeks ago, it has been faultless. It has had a couple of brief messages pop up about something not working but like any computer you just switch it off and back on again and the messages disappear.
It goes like stink, holds the road way better than it has any right to and if you are on the limit it is more likely to do a 4 wheel drift than anything else.
It is also quiet and extremely comfortable.
The satnav is rubbish and the infotainment system not exactly intuitive but you soon learn to get the things you use on a regular basis.
Useable range at town and A road speeds is about 200 miles in summer and about 175 in winter.
Motorway speeds in the summer you might get about 180 miles and about 150 in winter. If you drive nearer 80 than 70 you can take another 10% off those figures.
When I asked my wife what she might want next she said she would have another i-Pace.
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Post by Martin on Aug 9, 2022 10:00:41 GMT
So the survey says….100% reliable. Just getting in there before Mark adds fuel to Blarnos fire!  |
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Post by Blarno on Aug 9, 2022 10:47:57 GMT
I have no experience of JLR models personally, nor am I ever likely to, but if my neighbour's Disco 4 is anything to go by....
I also have a mate who runs the local LR independent service centre. He's kept in business very well indeed.
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Post by Roadrunner on Aug 9, 2022 11:11:39 GMT
Welcome back Alan. Glad to hear that life is largely treating you well. My 4x4 experience is much more agricultural than what is covered by the term 'SUV' so I can't offer much advice other than that I have always had a soft spot for JLR products.
My current fleet is very much as expected, consisting of a wafty Benz estate, a modern Mini and a vintage sports car. Still a vacant space in the garage, though...
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Post by bryan on Aug 9, 2022 11:13:17 GMT
So the survey says….100% reliable. Just getting in there before Mark adds fuel to Blarnos fire! I could blot that record! Whilst my Evoque plug in hybrid is great when it is working, 35miles on Electric, enough for local journeys and conveniently swift for longer journeys it hasn't exactly failed to proceed but in the 16 months since new it has -required a complete new drive shaft bearing/assembly and I suspect the other is on the way out. - high voltage heater failed meaning 6 months without ev or climate control. Good job it has a spare petrol engine! When it's all working it's great, but I wouldn't run one privately out of warranty |
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Post by PetrolEd on Aug 9, 2022 11:49:16 GMT
Hi Alan. We are 2 years into a 3 year i-Pace lease and with the exception of long distance driving, it has been fantastic. It is in the dealership today to get a new wheel under warranty but apart from that and a brake fluid and filter service 3 weeks ago, it has been faultless. It has had a couple of brief messages pop up about something not working but like any computer you just switch it off and back on again and the messages disappear. It goes like stink, holds the road way better than it has any right to and if you are on the limit it is more likely to do a 4 wheel drift than anything else. It is also quiet and extremely comfortable. The satnav is rubbish and the infotainment system not exactly intuitive but you soon learn to get the things you use on a regular basis. Useable range at town and A road speeds is about 200 miles in summer and about 175 in winter. Motorway speeds in the summer you might get about 180 miles and about 150 in winter. If you drive nearer 80 than 70 you can take another 10% off those figures. When I asked my wife what she might want next she said she would have another i-Pace. What's the official range on the I-Pace? The range is pretty shocking at motorway speed and understand that the I-Pace is one of the better performers , I guess that's between 20% and 80%? I still think an electric car would fit really well into our lives as 95% of journeys are sub 20miles, maybe the answer is to get a hire car if you need to go on the motorway for more then 100 miles. Welcome back Alan and congrats on married life. |
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Post by PG on Aug 9, 2022 12:27:43 GMT
Welcome back Alan. Glad you're well and enjoying life.
In terms of reliability, I am of the view that there are duff cars of all makes out there. Having had four LR products over the years, three were no less reliable than any other vehicle I've had, one (a Mk 1 Freelander) was a disaster area. But that was primarily caused by a dealer fault in servicing (forgetting to reconnect all the cooling system after a service) that led to multiple failures.
If you want a 4x4 and LR, but don't need to shift or tow loads of stuff, then I think a 2-3 year old petrol Evoque would tick pretty much all your boxes if you choose not to go EV. I've driven an I-Pace at a test day so don't have John's day to day experience of one, but it did seem very impressive.
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 9, 2022 14:44:32 GMT
Thanks all.
Thinking about reliability and please stay with me here... Some cultures believe that every object has a spirt which you need to respect and be in agreement with otherwise they may not cooperate. Whilst that may be a bit much for me to completely go along with I do think some people are almost magnetic when it comes to problems and that could be down to the way they treat things and how unsympathetic they are, thrashing cold engines and other excesses and the like. I seem to hit fewer issues than some others and I do think that this can be at least in part due to how sympathetically you treat things. I've seen a few reports of LR woes being down to the electronics which may be beyond how sympathetically or not your treat the car so that could be a worry but for something I've not tried yet maybe it's worth the risk.
I was initially looking at the Evoque and the Jag equivalent but more recently I've been thinking that the Discovery Sport is the better looking car but the Mrs prefers the Evoque as she thinks it looks more modern.
Any views on which is the better buy?
The wild card is the IPace. What are peoples views on electric in general? As above I'm worried about reports from African mines and South American Lithium lakes and I do worry that electric could be an absolute disaster further down the line plus there's the impact of the years on battery life. Would a used IPace with life already draining from the batteries be a risk too far?
Looking at used prices the petrol models seem to be holding their value better than I'd have thought but perhaps that's partly down to the sellers market we have at the mo whilst the IPace seems to lose a bit more than I'd thought it should. Could this be because of worries about used batteries?
Comments on these points are very very welcome...
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 9, 2022 14:54:38 GMT
Hi Alan. We are 2 years into a 3 year i-Pace lease and with the exception of long distance driving, it has been fantastic. It is in the dealership today to get a new wheel under warranty but apart from that and a brake fluid and filter service 3 weeks ago, it has been faultless. It has had a couple of brief messages pop up about something not working but like any computer you just switch it off and back on again and the messages disappear. It goes like stink, holds the road way better than it has any right to and if you are on the limit it is more likely to do a 4 wheel drift than anything else. It is also quiet and extremely comfortable. The satnav is rubbish and the infotainment system not exactly intuitive but you soon learn to get the things you use on a regular basis. Useable range at town and A road speeds is about 200 miles in summer and about 175 in winter. Motorway speeds in the summer you might get about 180 miles and about 150 in winter. If you drive nearer 80 than 70 you can take another 10% off those figures. When I asked my wife what she might want next she said she would have another i-Pace. What's the official range on the I-Pace? The range is pretty shocking at motorway speed and understand that the I-Pace is one of the better performers , I guess that's between 20% and 80%? I still think an electric car would fit really well into our lives as 95% of journeys are sub 20miles, maybe the answer is to get a hire car if you need to go on the motorway for more then 100 miles. Welcome back Alan and congrats on married life. One thing I do worry about is that electric can take away some spontaneity as I/we/you might not be able to get up in the morning and see it's a nice day and decide to go on a trip as unlike with combustion engine cars you can't expect to be able to fill up just about anywhere. For example we went to Harrogate Flower show a while back and parked in a field. A petrol car might have managed that return trip but a longer one might require planning and even diversions to top the batteries up. People say just hire a petrol/diesel car for longer trips but that's more planning and hassle and less spontaneity. |
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Post by Roadrunner on Aug 9, 2022 16:23:29 GMT
Why not split the difference and get a hybrid?
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 9, 2022 19:12:05 GMT
Why not split the difference and get a hybrid? I suppose it's a possibility. When searching I haven't been seeing them as I've been ordering the cars "cheapest first" and the petrol ones seem to be cheaper than the hybrids but yes, I suppose they're a possibility. Just to help whittle the options down I suppose the IPace stands on its own but any views on which is the best buy between the Evoque and the Discovery Sport? Or maybe there's nothing between them? |
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Post by ChrisM on Aug 9, 2022 20:14:04 GMT
Welcome back Alan.
Disco Sport is massive, like driving a small barn around. If you really want or need something that big then it will be an experience.
Evoque is more "normal" size
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Post by Martin on Aug 9, 2022 20:43:30 GMT
Welcome back Alan. Disco Sport is massive, like driving a small barn around. If you really want or need something that big then it will be an experience. Evoque is more "normal" size No it isn’t! Height yes, but its footprint is smaller than a Mondeo. More a garden shed than a small barn… Having being (slightly tongue in cheek) positive about the reliability of JLR products, I’d stay well away from the Discovery Sport. When I took mine in for a while you wait service and sat near the service desk, every Disco sport that came in for a service had other issues that needed looking at and I know a couple of people who’ve had one and had a string of issues. |
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Post by Sav on Aug 9, 2022 21:28:27 GMT
Welcome back Alan!
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Post by bryan on Aug 10, 2022 6:57:29 GMT
Aren't they based on the same platform with the disco sport having a longer rear overhang?
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Post by LandieMark on Aug 10, 2022 7:03:50 GMT
Welcome back. I would go for an Evoque, personally. I hear nothing but problems with Disco Sports and they feel smaller inside than the Freelander 2 it replaced.
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Post by Andy C on Aug 10, 2022 7:15:04 GMT
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Aug 10, 2022 7:19:06 GMT
That seems very expensive for a little E-Pace. wb Alan, btw |
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 10, 2022 10:12:55 GMT
Thanks all. I know the Sport is a bit bigger but I started looking at them because on the road I think it's a better looking car than the Evoque. I did start out preferring the Jag but Mrs WW thinks they look old fashioned and I suppose what the Mrs thinks has to be considered if only for an easy life I hadn't realised that the Sport has more issues than the Evoque and that is disappointing and surprising. I wonder why? So, maybe I should be looking more towards Evoque v Jag (if I can persuade Mrs WW) with the IPace being a possibility rather than Sport v Evoque v IPace? See... I was right to come and ask here |
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Post by PG on Aug 10, 2022 10:56:37 GMT
Aren't they based on the same platform with the disco sport having a longer rear overhang? I think they are based on the same chassis, with the Disco being loner at the rear as you say. But for some reason the wheelbase of the Disco Sport (per Autotrader, so maybe not the most accurate) is slightly longer. For the 2022 model year - Disco Sort w/base 2741mm, Evoque w/bae 2681mm. |
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Aug 10, 2022 11:06:26 GMT
Since the launch of the second generation model in 2019 the Discovery Sport has shared its underpinnings with the Evoqua and E-Pace. I know a couple of people with them, one had quite a few issues, the other, a farmer, has had none. I agree, they're not a big car.
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Post by woofwoof on Aug 10, 2022 12:10:09 GMT
I think the width is potentially more of an issue then the length as I have to get it down the drive although the length from the bumper to the rear edge of the drivers door also matters as I'll park it nose up to the garage and I need to open the door before the house starts... If you can follow that... but my Jag S was fine and fitted that gap ok so I'm hoping any of these cars will be ok too but I'll deffo check before buying When out and about I tend to park in easy to get into places and I don't mind if that means walking a bit further so I can't see the length of any of these as being the deciding factor. I may be wrong but that's how I see it until I'm proven wrong. None of these will be going in the garage as it's just too small with too much stuff in it. The MX5 just squeezes in but I have to take the areal off as the up and over door catches it when closing. |
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Post by Ben on Aug 10, 2022 13:06:10 GMT
Welcome back Alan. Hope you've been well.
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Post by racingteatray on Aug 10, 2022 13:11:05 GMT
Welcome back.
I know nothing of Evoque vs Disco Sport other than having poked about in two that were next to each other in Lookers when I was eyeing up a Velar. As others have said the 2nd gen Evoque is noticeably more compact without being small.
Also, a colleague has a Disco Sport and it is forever breaking down.
I must admit that the endless tales of woe from various colleagues and friends put me right off the idea of a Velar, much as we both liked it (we had a random upgrade to one from Hertz on holiday in late 2019, which rather converted my hitherto SUV-hating wife).
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