Christian Horner

Its all just complete speculation from willy pictures to abusing staff. But the internet has spoken and therefore he must be guilty of something. Its just us as the readership who laps this stuff up. Look on the Pistonheads forum for the madness.

Setting the allegations aside as I don't know what they are, I have always liked Horner. Hes a character and from the old school. If I listen to someone like James Vowles he could just as well be the boss of Apple, Natwest or a politician. They'll offend nobody in their time but equally it makes them dull and in sport you want excitement. F1 is 50% racing and 50% the paddock in fighting. Always has been. Why was Drive to Survive so popular? We all love the drama. Gunther, Toto and Horner make the show. The new guys taking over just don't bring the noise.

Times are changing and I guess so must the dinosaurs involved.

Onto the gossip, its sad how people instantly assume he was hands on with a staff member. Maybe he was but let it come out. Guilty before being proved innocent is a bore. I understand this is some sort of power play between Red Bull in Europe/ Jos the Boss / Marko vs RB Thailand and Horner.

If he goes it might be enough to distabalise Red Bull Racing from the top. Still get Horner into Ferrari and if he wins then he can do and say what the hell he likes.

I have always admired Horner if not liked him particularly and I think the comments about Jos Verstappen stirring the spoon are more than likely correct. There always seemed to be a bit of tension between Horner and Verstappen Snr when there was any filming in the garage.

Newey and Hamilton to Ferrari would be fantastically exciting and might allow some of the Newey magic to impact the 2025 car. They could take Horner as well but such moves would leave Red Bull in a very vulnerable position. Do you think that Jos wants to be team boss?

Much as I dislike Horner this does sound like someone has not been performing and been called out for it, and is now crying wolf.

I didn't like Horner's triumphalism when Hamilton was robbed of the 2021 drivers' championship but I do think he is very good at leading his team and inspiring the younger generation.

It does seem as if there are various agendas at play here. I really don't think much of Jos Verstappen's character and values. Am a big believer in innocent until proven guilty, but mud will stick here whatever the outcome.

I really hope Horner doesn't go to Ferrari but it would be great for Hamilton if Newey does.

Well he was cleared on Wednesday and now a load of pictures and WhatsApp messages have been e-mailed to pretty much everyone of significance in F1 and many journalist, it's not looking good, someone wants him gone.

I got the messages from a mate of mine who was on the list as he's in the F1 circus. Initially it looks a bit like AI generated gumpf but if it was fake you think the architect of the messages would have gone a little more overboard on the smutt.

Its all rather unsavory and he looks as guilty. Bet he can't wait for the race to start to there is something else to talk about. I'm very surprised in todays workplace that RB didn't think there was much of a case to answer but whatever has gone on its clear that someone is bankrolling Horners demise.

Its also disappointing that F1 finds itself in such a place. A few years ago there is no way that people like Toto and Brown would fuel the flames of this in the media. Ron would have just entered the TP press conference eating a bowl of coco pops (one of the messages)and be done with it.

From what I've seen, Its not an affair its a few sleazy flirty messages on whats app which the woman has gone a long with for a while but obviously found reason to take to HR. If she has been made to feel uncomfortable and her job no longer viable with him in control then I guess he has to go.

I am assuming that RB had provided the lady in question with a big payoff and found Horner to be clear of wrongdoing for the good of the organisation. Its the intervention of the possible third party that has leaked these messages thats thrown the cat amongst the pigeons.

I'm not one to judge, and I agree that people make mistakes. But I view moral wrongdoings like affairs with a slightly different perspective.

I think what having an affair indicates is cultivating mistrust. In the sense that if you could do something behind your partner's back, what else could you be hiding (or capable of hiding) at work? Affairs involve calculated lying, and that's quite a slippery slope to go down.

If you want to hook up with someone else, do it openly. Talk to your partner, get a divorce or separation if need be. It's difficult but it's the right thing to do. Sneaking around and hiding your tracks is cowardly.

It's particularly bad timing given that fuel has also just been added to the Me Too fire with the report on how Wayne Cousins got a job as a cop despite a string of serious allegations. Not that I'm equating CH to him in any way but just merely to point out that now is not a great time for RB to be accused of brushing allegations of sexual harassment under the carpet, however true they may turn out to be.

If it was just flirting it really shows how in today's world of using WhatsApp to communicate I'd be really really careful about being in anyway flirtatious with a female colleague (not that I would as I'm happily married). I dont think I'd dare ask a female colleague out on a date these days so it's no wonder most people meet on dating apps rather than at work.

As far as the start of the F1 season goes I wonder if also they'll want to sandbag Max's car and will be begging him not to go out and kick everyone's arses each week at least until this blows over!

Ive had a read through of the messages and while its not evidence of truly horrible bullying, coercion, or aggression, it massively oversteps the mark of what is acceptable in the workplace. It sounds like something had happened between them at some point, but over and over again, he is the one driving the conversation that way and she repeatedly says "stop", refuses to take video calls/asks him to stop video calling her (from hotel beds it would seem!), and asks him to call his wife or children instead. He repeatedly asks for pictures in a clearly sexualised way, sends her pictures of his bodyparts, sexualises the conversation over and over again, and asks her to delete the thread 3 or 4 times.

Carrying on with the behaviour after being told to stop is clearly unnacceptable. As is calling her "miss boring pants" or something along those lines for asking him to stop, that's straight bullying. Sending unsolicited body parts pics likewise.

If he was a faceless exec in a big company, this would be a displiplinary but might not result in job loss if it stayed private (though I think it should). But now its public, I can't see how any major company in this day and age can stand by it, or how they or he can claim no one did anything wrong. Or how he can continue to be the face of the biggest sporting arm of that company, or continue to represent its sponsors, who must now be under pressure to pull back their sponsorship. Working for a big Japanese company in the motor industry as I do, I cannot imagine Honda will be anything other than totally livid about it, for a start. 

I think he's now walking dead, like Boris was after the full partygate evidence came out...

I reckon it's been blown up so much because that first race was Mogadon on wheels. Nothing else for the media to put in the news about F1.

But isn't that always the way? The longer you are at the top the more people who want to knock you off your perch.

New twist:

jalopnik.com/red-bull-was-ready-to-fire-christian-horner-but-he-thr-1851304858

Given how long he's been at the top of the business I can imagine it's not just as simple for RB as just giving him the sack. He's probably very much intertwined within the structural ownership of the company. I can see it being a very messy divorce (and that's before you start on his marriage to Geri!)