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Post by garry on Sept 2, 2021 12:20:00 GMT
Have to say, Biden is making Trump look more presidential with every passing day. He's a senile old duffer who lacks the strength of character, energy and intelligence to hold office. Trump might have been a grotesque, perma-tanned womanising knobhead, but he kept the world in check. Can't help but think Xi Jinping, Putin and any number extremist Islamic nations are going to capitalise on the Biden precedency.
The world was a safer place with Trump in the White House. Biden poses a serious risk to world peace.
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Post by ChrisM on Sept 2, 2021 12:35:38 GMT
Have to say, Biden is making Trump look more presidential with every passing day. He's a senile old duffer who lacks the strength of character, energy and intelligence to hold office. That was known before the election, yet he still won. The bets are apparently on him snuffing it soon, and Kamala Harris becoming the first female POTUS |
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 2, 2021 12:47:33 GMT
I don’t think American politics has a hope whilst there is an American electorate and a system of candidacy that favours the largest purse to such an extent. The UK is not much better, the Tory party coffers completely annihilating the bank accounts of other parties and the main opposition funded by a unionist concept that is alien to a huge percentage of voters.
Brexit, Trumpism and the border restrictions imposed by Covid have shown that, on a voter level, world politics means nothing compared to national interests. For all the jumping up and down the European press and the liberal press in the US make about Afghanistan withdrawal (a Trump policy…..) there is a far larger swell of indifference meaning political positions can remain unchanged.
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Post by johnc on Sept 2, 2021 13:17:28 GMT
Apathy rules, especially if it doesn't impact the individual involved.
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Post by PetrolEd on Sept 2, 2021 13:19:49 GMT
Brexit, Trumpism and the border restrictions imposed by Covid have shown that, on a voter level, world politics means nothing compared to national interests. For all the jumping up and down the European press and the liberal press in the US make about Afghanistan withdrawal (a Trump policy…..) there is a far larger swell of indifference meaning political positions can remain unchanged. It would have been interesting to see how Trump would have reacted to takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban. Wouldn't have surprised me if he'd just ignored the problem or more worryingly gone full scale WW3. |
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Post by Tim on Sept 2, 2021 13:53:04 GMT
Brexit, Trumpism and the border restrictions imposed by Covid have shown that, on a voter level, world politics means nothing compared to national interests. For all the jumping up and down the European press and the liberal press in the US make about Afghanistan withdrawal (a Trump policy…..) there is a far larger swell of indifference meaning political positions can remain unchanged. It would have been interesting to see how Trump would have reacted to takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban. Wouldn't have surprised me if he'd just ignored the problem or more worryingly gone full scale WW3. Trump did a deal with the Taliban 18 months ago and planned to have the troops out by the end of MAy. I'm not sure that would've gone any more smoothly than what has happened under Biden. There's no way the world was safer under Trump and as for him keeping Putin and Xi Jinping in check is surely a massive joke? It's clear that Putin has a lot of dirt on Trump and I'm pretty sure that the US trade war with China has cost normal Yanks a lot of money. The trouble the US has is that out of a populace of 300M those 2 are the best candidates they could muster. |
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Post by Ben on Sept 2, 2021 15:10:36 GMT
The world was a safer place with Trump in the White House. Biden poses a serious risk to world peace. You can't honestly be serious with this. Trump nearly started WW3 with Iran, before everything was quickly forgotten once the virus took over the world. |
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Sept 2, 2021 15:56:34 GMT
The whole Covid issue was a massive boost to Biden as he just remained in his bunker, said nothing, and allowed the press to take down Trump. I've never seen a President elected with so little campaigning or scrutiny. That's not saying I wanted Trump to win - I didn't, he's a complete c*nt. Unfortunately, I think the c*nt is a shoe in to be re-elected in 2024.
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Post by michael on Sept 2, 2021 16:12:00 GMT
The world was a safer place with Trump in the White House. Biden poses a serious risk to world peace. Trump was orange and the media made fun of him and so he's stupid and anything he said was automatically wrong. Biden therefore is a brilliant and compassionate president, particularly with young woman and girls. |
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 2, 2021 16:30:12 GMT
As regards Afghanistan specifically, it was Trump's policy. Biden's error, depending on your point of view, was to continue the policy. Either way, this would not have gone better under Trump and to suggest otherwise would be unwise.
There was a good piece on this by Justin Webb in The Times recently for any of you with a subscription.
For what it's worth I don't remotely think the Biden administration is making life easier for the Xis and Putins of this world than Trump would have done.
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 2, 2021 16:34:53 GMT
The world was a safer place with Trump in the White House. Biden poses a serious risk to world peace. Trump was orange and the media made fun of him and so he's stupid and anything he said was automatically wrong. Biden therefore is a brilliant and compassionate president, particularly with young woman and girls. I would guess that Trump never actually literally grabbed anyone by their pussy, but nevertheless I wouldn't pick behaviour towards women as a winning line of attack when seeking to contrast Trump with Biden. |
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Post by PG on Sept 2, 2021 19:33:23 GMT
Garry pretty much summed it up. Everybody said that Trump would start WW3 etc etc and yet actually none of that happened and some completely unexpected things happened - like some Arab countries doing peace deals with Israel; a US President meeting Kim Jong-Un; someone at last calling out China's mercantalist IPR-thieving / infair trade ways.
I didn't like Trump, but you had to respect him.
What we have now is the old adage coming round - bad times create strong leaders; strong leaders create good times; good times create weak leaders; weak leaders create bad times. We've now got a weak leader in the White House.
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Post by Alex on Sept 2, 2021 20:37:38 GMT
Biden does come across as incredibly meek and unsure of his own words at times. I know Trump didn't always say things that most sane people would consider to be normal but he did at least mean what he said and wasn't afraid to say what he thought. Sometimes it was the ramblings of a madman but that's largely because his mouth was muttering every thought as they were being thought without processing them first. A bit like our own esteemed leader.
The point is that with Trump you knew where you were even if you didn't necessarily like it. With Biden I find it hard to know if he even believes his own words and he doesn't come across as strong or decisive. More importantly he doesn't come across as presidential and that is a weak position for the US to be in.
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 2, 2021 21:11:09 GMT
Of course not everything Trump did was wrong or not useful. A broken clock is after all right twice a day. But I think the good was more by accident than design - he basically scared the rest of the world out of a complacent view that America would always be there to save the day.
Biden might not be especially impressive, nor Harris. But they are light years better than Trump and the people around him. People either forget that there was some seriously nasty shit there, or else perhaps that was in fact also their kind of shit. However it’s not mine and never will be.
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Post by garry on Sept 3, 2021 7:31:50 GMT
The issue is that the chaotic exit from Afghanistan will be seen as American weakness. Others will take advantage of this - they will be more willing to test Biden. Trump, with his (many) failings projected strength (and a level of unpredictability) that made others less willing to test him. Think of it like a business issue; if your key competitor appointed a new CEO who immediately looked flaky you would take advantage of the opportunity and go after them faster and harder before that CEO got fired.
Biden's appalling handling of the withdrawal means we're sailing into choppy water, where countries are going to test the the resolve of America because it looks more testable. China and Russia will also look at how they can fill the power vacuum.
As for Trump making the world a little bit safer, you can laugh, you can claim he got lucky, you can claim a broken clock is right twice a day, but I'd argue that those characteristics in him that many of us hate (the ego, the bravado, the need to look like he's won, etc) unnerved potential opponents and made them back off. No one is going to feel much fear in poking Biden.
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Post by Tim on Sept 3, 2021 8:01:14 GMT
I don't think Trump projected anything like strength at all.
He managed to upset a lot of his allies, showed he doesn't care in the slightest about anyone apart from those close to him (or those with some dirt on him) and generally acted in an unstatesmanlike manner. I think the US lost a lot of respect under his Presidency.
Despite Russia being a shadow of its former self I'd say Putin manages to project strength (and guile) and you certainly wouldn't want to mess with him.
Trump's main aims were clearly the advancement of the Trump bank accounts.
Having said all that Biden certainly doesn't come across as a strong and decisive leader but then perhaps he's happy to delegate tasks to those that know better and be a CEO rather than a micro manager?
I don't think Trump is a shoe-in for 2024. His banning from social media has left a void that quite a few further-right-wingers are seeking to fill and from what I've read the legal system is slowly working its way up to prosecute him for all manner of dodgy business activities from both before and during his presidency.
Not just that but also the investigation into his role in the 6th January storming of the Capitol.
He's either going to be dead (he's not a healthy man), in the dock or hiding away having plead dementia (the Ernest Saunders defence) which would surely exclude him from running - although nothing would surprise me in the US.
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Post by garry on Sept 3, 2021 8:19:45 GMT
I don't think Trump projected anything like strength at all. He managed to upset a lot of his allies, showed he doesn't care in the slightest about anyone apart from those close to him (or those with some dirt on him) and generally acted in an unstatesmanlike manner. I think the US lost a lot of respect under his Presidency. From us liberal Europeans? Sure. From those regions that are more likely to destabilise the world? Respect might not be the right word but he unnerved them enough. |
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Post by johnc on Sept 3, 2021 8:24:03 GMT
In my job, I deal with a lot of more elderly clients with a lot of money and lots of choices. Once people are over 70, I start to see a marked change in behaviour, where decisions are deferred (and seldom taken), major issues are just side stepped and generally little changes. That's why I try to get clients to take decisions like gifting to children/grandchildren when they are in their 60's because after that, in the majority of cases, planning is like wading through treacle.
Biden is 78 years old and Trump is 75, I believe. In my experience that puts them both firmly in the "unfit for POTAS" camp.
IMHO Trump was irrational and Biden is just past it, so my only hope is that Biden steps aside and we get someone (Harris) who at least has age on her side and hopefully a reasonable decision making capability.
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 3, 2021 8:36:12 GMT
I don't think Trump unnerved them at all - they saw a kindred spirit as well as an easily flattered and manipulated narcissist. The North Koreans ran rings around him. And the Russians and Chinese, and de facto dictators all around the world, were able to point to all Trump's noise about stolen elections and the storming of the Capital and suchlike behaviour to argue to their citizens that the Western model of democracy was being finally unmasked as dangerous, flawed and doomed to failure.
I'm not sure Biden is any more or less than say Dubya at this point. His main plus is not being Trump. His main defect seems to be that he's quite happy to stick to a lot of Trumpian foreign policy of the "America First" variety. But since most other countries also pursue a strategy that puts their interests first, I'm not sure that collectively we can really object to "America First" that much without being deeply hypocritical. Brexit is, after all, nothing if not 100% "Britain First".
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Post by Big Blue on Sept 3, 2021 8:59:38 GMT
I'm not sure that collectively we can really object to "America First" that much without being deeply hypocritical. Brexit is, after all, nothing if not 100% "Britain First". As I said above. World politics is not important to us until it arrives on our doorstep. My late father said he would buy three or four large houses adjacent to ministerial family homes and house refugees in them three to a room if he won the lottery. That’s the kind of doorstep arrival I’m talking of - why Kent, areas of Italy, Hungary, Greece and Marseille are so right wing. |
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Post by garry on Sept 3, 2021 10:30:06 GMT
I don't think Trump unnerved them at all - they saw a kindred spirit as well as an easily flattered and manipulated narcissist. The North Koreans ran rings around him. And the Russians and Chinese, and de facto dictators all around the world, were able to point to all Trump's noise about stolen elections and the storming of the Capital and suchlike behaviour to argue to their citizens that the Western model of democracy was being finally unmasked as dangerous, flawed and doomed to failure. But he didn’t start any new wars or create any new failed states. Worth remembering that the three presidents before him can't claim the same thing. Could have just been luck I guess, but I still contend that there is something in the Trump persona that would cause an aggressor to pause, mostly because there's a level of unpredictability in his response. |
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Post by Ben on Sept 3, 2021 11:03:59 GMT
I don't think Trump unnerved them at all - they saw a kindred spirit as well as an easily flattered and manipulated narcissist. The North Koreans ran rings around him. And the Russians and Chinese, and de facto dictators all around the world, were able to point to all Trump's noise about stolen elections and the storming of the Capital and suchlike behaviour to argue to their citizens that the Western model of democracy was being finally unmasked as dangerous, flawed and doomed to failure. But he didn’t start any new wars or create any new failed states. Worth remembering that the three presidents before him can't claim the same thing. Could have just been luck I guess, but I still contend that there is something in the Trump persona that would cause an aggressor to pause, mostly because there's a level of unpredictability in his response. More likely incompetence. He couldn't even keep his own domestic house in check, let alone know how to start a war with someone else. |
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Post by Tim on Sept 3, 2021 11:07:28 GMT
I don't think Trump unnerved them at all - they saw a kindred spirit as well as an easily flattered and manipulated narcissist. The North Koreans ran rings around him. And the Russians and Chinese, and de facto dictators all around the world, were able to point to all Trump's noise about stolen elections and the storming of the Capital and suchlike behaviour to argue to their citizens that the Western model of democracy was being finally unmasked as dangerous, flawed and doomed to failure. But he didn’t start any new wars or create any new failed states. Worth remembering that the three presidents before him can't claim the same thing. Could have just been luck I guess, but I still contend that there is something in the Trump persona that would cause an aggressor to pause, mostly because there's a level of unpredictability in his response. I think you could easily overcome the unpredictability by telling him what a great guy he is and if you also booked your entourage into one of his hotels, well, he'd probably send Melania or Ivanka round to give you a blow job. |
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Sept 3, 2021 11:24:22 GMT
But he didn’t start any new wars or create any new failed states. Worth remembering that the three presidents before him can't claim the same thing. Could have just been luck I guess, but I still contend that there is something in the Trump persona that would cause an aggressor to pause, mostly because there's a level of unpredictability in his response. I think you could easily overcome the unpredictability by telling him what a great guy he is and if you also booked your entourage into one of his hotels, well, he'd probably send Melania or Ivanka round to give you a blow job. Melania looks like she could suck a golf ball through a 20ft hose. |
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Post by racingteatray on Sept 3, 2021 12:22:09 GMT
One imagines that capability was among those on the spec sheet the FSB gave their bionics development team...
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