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Post by racingteatray on Dec 13, 2019 10:44:41 GMT
But I think this is also a great opportunity for the Conservatives to do something for the whole country and show that they are not just a party of the south of England. If dealt with properly this could do the country a lot of good. +1. Very few people saw this result coming. The most I hoped for was a 20 seat majority if the Conservatives did really, really well. The key point is, however, that the Tories actually didn't do really, really well. The Tory vote nationally only increased by 1.1%.
Now that's unusual for a party after a decade in power admittedly, but what it really shows is that the result came about because Labour did really, really badly.
That dreadful waste of oxygen Dominic Raab, choosing to ignore that his own majority had been slashed by 20,000 or so, declared the result to be "a vindication of the Tory's policies" (or words to that effect). Let's be very clear - it was no such thing. It was instead a complete repudiation of Corbynomics, which granted the Tories a whopping "get of jail free" card.
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Post by michael on Dec 13, 2019 10:48:49 GMT
That’s right. The tories lost.
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Post by LandieMark on Dec 13, 2019 11:07:09 GMT
They gained 66 seats and Labour lost 42. I would say the Tories did better than Labour doing badly. Vote percentage would only be important in a proportional representation system, surely.
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Post by racingteatray on Dec 13, 2019 11:21:24 GMT
That’s right. The tories lost. You're better than that kind of schoolyard remark.
You know perfectly well what I meant.
In the past couple of weeks, I lost count of the vast number of people (friends, family, colleagues) who told me they thought that Boris and the Tories were dreadful, but that in the final reckoning they weren't as dreadful as Corbyn. Fear of Corbyn overcame fear of Brexit and is assuredly why the Tory vote held up among such London voters.
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Post by michael on Dec 13, 2019 11:28:30 GMT
That’s right. The tories lost. You're better than that kind of schoolyard remark.
You know perfectly well what I meant.
In the past couple of weeks, I lost count of the vast number of people (friends, family, colleagues) who told me they thought that Boris and the Tories were dreadful, but that in the final reckoning they weren't as dreadful as Corbyn. Fear of Corbyn overcame fear of Brexit and is assuredly why the Tory vote held up among such London voters.
London isn’t the centre of the earth politically any more, it is just one part.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Dec 13, 2019 11:32:22 GMT
You're better than that kind of schoolyard remark.
You know perfectly well what I meant.
In the past couple of weeks, I lost count of the vast number of people (friends, family, colleagues) who told me they thought that Boris and the Tories were dreadful, but that in the final reckoning they weren't as dreadful as Corbyn. Fear of Corbyn overcame fear of Brexit and is assuredly why the Tory vote held up among such London voters.
London isn’t the centre of the earth politically any more, it is just one part. I think London isn't really part of the UK anymore. It's an island in a bubble.
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Post by Big Blue on Dec 13, 2019 11:37:20 GMT
Labour failed because:
Their Leader didn't come out in favour of or against Brexit. This was because whilst his Islington-set champagne socialist friends were pro-EU his heartland voters are very xenophobic. He couldn't be seen to align with xenophobes, or for that matter the opposite party, so he instead stayed silent on the issue that actually brought about this election. Prick.
He also lost an awful lot of votes in what should be Labour heartlands because he and his cabal are champagne socialists. They would be the ones driving around in Zils, sideswiping the proletariat on their wagons pulled by donkeys, in a previous world in another country. People smoking roll-ups, drinking warm ale and farting in public don't like being told that a man living in a large house in Islington that wants to buy the railway that only Tory people in the south use to any great extent (and only about 11% of the population) is their natural leader.
He was also never ever ever going to win a single swing voter with a manifesto that was so radically socialist because......
.....most of the population in the UK is conservative with a small "c" and as such the Conservatives won because they represented some element of the status quo (no matter how shite it is people do NOT like change foisted upon them) and they also played on the fears and terrors of those that had fears and terrors to be played upon, winning some swing voters as well as those small "c" conservative Labour folks.
Whatever the urban elite (twitter users are a particularly vociferous member of this group) think people don't care about the wider nation, they care (as dictated by Maslow's hierarchy) about themselves and their own first. Is is any surprise that the most successful Labour government ever was conservative in everything but name? - this is what the people that vote are like, including myself. I'm a natural Conservative but they didn't get my vote - the current party leadership is a bag of shite. I didn't vote Labour either, but had they presented a more balanced, less radical manifesto, made a stance on the EU and had voted in a leader that was more palatable to the nation as a whole I might have done. This, unsurprisingly, is the overriding factor for the Conservative success: it's not just the overriding xenophobic tendencies of the English (remember, you're never a foreigner if you're English, even when abroad) or the fact that people hate paying tax of any kind, even one pence (I always look at how I could pay less tax legitimately - it's not as if I'm poor but it's the principle) - they selected a leader that was palatable to the nation as a whole.
They don't care if he's fathered several children by different women (I have, so who am I to judge?); they don't care if he's lied to get what and where he wants (squeaky clean leaders are really dull!) and ultimately they don't care what the manifesto means for them in the short or long term - they like the figure head and no one ever followed a leader they didn't want to. Despite what the Germans told us all in the late 1940s.
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Post by Big Blue on Dec 13, 2019 11:43:35 GMT
I think London isn't really part of the UK anymore. It's an island in a bubble. Interestingly enough I said something similar to W2.1 the other day: London is almost its own religion. You either believe in it or you don't, and if you move here you can be persuaded to believe or you can denounce it as evil.
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Post by Tim on Dec 13, 2019 12:03:51 GMT
It's the Yorkshire of The South
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Post by Tim on Dec 13, 2019 12:14:18 GMT
I wonder when we'll see the re-emergence of Jacob Rees-Mogg. He's been oddly quiet these last few weeks.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 12:20:05 GMT
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Post by racingteatray on Dec 13, 2019 13:01:00 GMT
You're better than that kind of schoolyard remark.
You know perfectly well what I meant.
In the past couple of weeks, I lost count of the vast number of people (friends, family, colleagues) who told me they thought that Boris and the Tories were dreadful, but that in the final reckoning they weren't as dreadful as Corbyn. Fear of Corbyn overcame fear of Brexit and is assuredly why the Tory vote held up among such London voters.
London isn’t the centre of the earth politically any more, it is just one part. Never said it was. Besides I'm not from London anyway, nor did I grow up here, so when I refer to friends and family it is wrong to assume I am talking about other Londoners.
Unless "London" is now a generic term for anything south-east of a line drawn from Southampton to the Wash.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Dec 13, 2019 13:06:36 GMT
London isn’t the centre of the earth politically any more, it is just one part. Never said it was. Besides I'm not from London anyway, nor did I grow up here, so when I refer to friends and family it is wrong to assume I am talking about other Londoners.
Unless "London" is now a generic term for anything south-east of a line drawn from Southampton to the Wash.
London is basically inside the M25, those that live there and those that gravitate there to work.
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Post by Big Blue on Dec 13, 2019 13:16:38 GMT
Draw around the whole of Essex, down to Haslemere in Surrey, Sevenoaks in Kent, Midhurst in W. Sussex, Middlesex, Stevenage in Herts and that's about right. From what I hear in the city chuck in some suburbs in NYC, Paris, Geneva, Madrid and Frankfurt as well.
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Post by michael on Dec 13, 2019 13:18:01 GMT
London isn’t the centre of the earth politically any more, it is just one part. Never said it was. Besides I'm not from London anyway, nor did I grow up here, so when I refer to friends and family it is wrong to assume I am talking about other Londoners.
Unless "London" is now a generic term for anything south-east of a line drawn from Southampton to the Wash.
And I never said you were. It's a comment on London in reply to your comment on London.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 14:07:17 GMT
Born in London but frankly hate what it is now and I would not go back if I was paid to. Waiting and hoping for HS-2 et al to be canned. How many homes for low paid people will be lost? 20 minutes saved for a very few people while people who cannot or will not use it lose their homes. Why not put the money into the network as a whole and benefit more people?
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Post by PetrolEd on Dec 13, 2019 14:25:45 GMT
Draw around the whole of Essex, down to Haslemere in Surrey, Sevenoaks in Kent, Midhurst in W. Sussex, Middlesex, Stevenage in Herts and that's about right. From what I hear in the city chuck in some suburbs in NYC, Paris, Geneva, Madrid and Frankfurt as well. Oi, I most certainly am not London. It might be 55 mins on the train or 30 odd miles to the city but it might as well be a million miles away. It really does feel like a foreign country to the rest of the UK.
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Post by PetrolEd on Dec 13, 2019 14:28:09 GMT
Born in London but frankly hate what it is now and I would not go back if I was paid to. Waiting and hoping for HS-2 et al to be canned. How many homes for low paid people will be lost? 20 minutes saved for a very few people while people who cannot or will not use it lose their homes. Why not put the money into the network as a whole and benefit more people? I thought it was businesses in the north that were demanding HS2 go ahead? If thats the case and he stands up to his promise to support the new Tory loving northerners I'm sure it'll be high on the agenda.
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Post by racingteatray on Dec 13, 2019 15:41:05 GMT
Draw around the whole of Essex, down to Haslemere in Surrey, Sevenoaks in Kent, Midhurst in W. Sussex, Middlesex, Stevenage in Herts and that's about right. From what I hear in the city chuck in some suburbs in NYC, Paris, Geneva, Madrid and Frankfurt as well. Oi, I most certainly am not London. It might be 55 mins on the train or 30 odd miles to the city but it might as well be a million miles away. It really does feel like a foreign country to the rest of the UK. Does it? I don't feel like I've stepped into another country when in Birmingham or Ipswich or Newbury or whichever small rural village I happen to be in. Certainly no more so than venturing say, out of Milan into rural Italy.
The views and attitudes of the residents differ for sure, as they do between big cities and rural backwaters the world over, but it's still recognisably British.
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Post by Tim on Dec 13, 2019 16:05:01 GMT
Born in London but frankly hate what it is now and I would not go back if I was paid to. Waiting and hoping for HS-2 et al to be canned. How many homes for low paid people will be lost? 20 minutes saved for a very few people while people who cannot or will not use it lose their homes. Why not put the money into the network as a whole and benefit more people? I thought it was businesses in the north that were demanding HS2 go ahead? If thats the case and he stands up to his promise to support the new Tory loving northerners I'm sure it'll be high on the agenda. There are plenty of other things they could do first 'oop north' I reckon. There's no point in having a super fancy HS link and then getting onto some clanky old, unreliable, slow diesel for the 2nd half of your journey.
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Post by Martin on Dec 13, 2019 16:09:27 GMT
I thought it was businesses in the north that were demanding HS2 go ahead? If thats the case and he stands up to his promise to support the new Tory loving northerners I'm sure it'll be high on the agenda. There are plenty of other things they could do first 'oop north' I reckon. There's no point in having a super fancy HS link and then getting onto some clanky old, unreliable, slow diesel for the 2nd half of your journey. I thought you were reasonably happy with your 3 series?
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Post by Tim on Dec 13, 2019 16:19:31 GMT
There are plenty of other things they could do first 'oop north' I reckon. There's no point in having a super fancy HS link and then getting onto some clanky old, unreliable, slow diesel for the 2nd half of your journey. I thought you were reasonably happy with your 3 series? I am but I've been driving some shite Audi equivalent for the last few weeks and its upset me
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Post by Martin on Dec 13, 2019 16:29:18 GMT
I thought you were reasonably happy with your 3 series? I am but I've been driving some shite Audi equivalent for the last few weeks and its upset me Ahhhh, that makes sense now!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 18:42:07 GMT
Just caught a bit of the news and they were interviewing north eastern folk about their new Conservative MP. Most were saying they didn't vote for the Tories, they voted against Labour.
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Post by michael on Dec 13, 2019 19:02:08 GMT
It's amazing how toxic Corbyn was on the doorstep. Labours anti Semitism came up over and over again which was really reassuring that people do care about racism.
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Post by Bob Sacamano v2.0 on Dec 13, 2019 20:12:28 GMT
It's amazing how toxic Corbyn was on the doorstep. Labours anti Semitism came up over and over again which was really reassuring that people do care about racism. But I thought they were all xenophobes?
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Post by michael on Dec 13, 2019 22:30:23 GMT
It's amazing how toxic Corbyn was on the doorstep. Labours anti Semitism came up over and over again which was really reassuring that people do care about racism. But I thought they were all xenophobes? I find that when people don’t understand something they come up with monsters. The Brexit vote wasn’t about racism for many, it was about change.
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Post by LandieMark on Dec 13, 2019 23:47:38 GMT
The TV people were interviewing the good Tory voting citizens of Consett this afternoon. 😂. The general consensus was that they didn't want a Tory MP, but they wanted Corbyn less. They also felt aggrieved that Pidcock treated them like peasents by voting against every single Brexit vote.
This was on Pistonheads earlier.
😂😂😂
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Post by michael on Dec 14, 2019 11:53:57 GMT
I had to check this wasn’t faked. No wonder she has been locked away for the campaign.
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Post by Boxer6 on Dec 14, 2019 12:10:03 GMT
I saw another post that showed the unphotoshopped versiosn of that image; sadly I can't find it now, due to Facebooks usual crap algorithms.
I must say that even in this image you don't have to look very closely to see it's faked.
Also, in point of fact, anti-semitism is NOT racism. Both are abhorrent, but not the same. Just saying.
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